X360

Project Gotham Racing 4 Project Gotham Racing 4

Microsoft Game Studios / Bizarre Creations

Type: Racing

Release date: Available

 
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Bizarre Creations interview

Bizarre Creations interview

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2007-10-06 12:09:47 by Manager

The great Ben Ward, Community & Web Lead over at Bizarre Creations, has taken time to answer a big bunch of questions about Project Gotham Racing 4. Thanks to the XCN, we can find out more about their thoughts about PGR3, team online racing, DLC and much much more.
 
Vidéos		 Since Format Size
DLC Tourist gameplay		 > 3 Months 640x360 37 MB
DLC Tourist gameplay		 > 3 Months 640x360 35 MB
DLC Faux gameplay		 > 3 Months 640x360 44 MB
DLC Faux gameplay		 > 3 Months 640x360 41 MB
DLC Tourist gameplay		 > 3 Months 640x360 29 MB
DLC Faux gameplay		 > 3 Months 640x360 35 MB
Geometry Wars Waves		 > 3 Months 640x360 80 MB
Geometry Wars Waves		 > 3 Months 1280x720 260 MB
Superstar Challenge London		 > 3 Months 640x360 85 MB
Superstar Challenge London		 > 3 Months 1280x720 283 MB
Speed Challenge Las Vegas		 > 3 Months 640x360 24 MB
Speed Challenge Las Vegas		 > 3 Months 1280x720 74 MB
Electric Car		 > 3 Months 640x360 69 MB
Electric Car		 > 3 Months 1280x720 219 MB
Cone Gate London		 > 3 Months 640x360 117 MB
Cone Gate London		 > 3 Months 1280x720 371 MB
Time Vs Kudos St Petersburg		 > 3 Months 640x360 81 MB
Time Vs Kudos St Petersburg		 > 3 Months 1280x720 256 MB
Time Vs Kudos Quebec		 > 3 Months 640x360 142 MB
Time Vs Kudos Quebec		 > 3 Months 1280x720 488 MB
The first 10 minutes: PGR4		 > 3 Months 640x360 251 MB
The first 10 minutes: PGR4		 > 3 Months 1280x720 759 MB
Geometry Wars Waves		 > 3 Months 1280x720 201 MB
Cone Gate London		 > 3 Months 1280x720 343 MB
Electric Car		 > 3 Months 1280x720 205 MB
The first 10 minutes: PGR4		 > 3 Months 1280x720 721 MB
Speed Challenge Las Vegas		 > 3 Months 1280x720 69 MB
Superstar Challenge London		 > 3 Months 1280x720 269 MB
Time Vs Kudos Quebec		 > 3 Months 1280x720 466 MB
Time Vs Kudos St Petersburg		 > 3 Months 1280x720 241 MB
Live Action vs Game		 > 3 Months 640x360 6 MB
Live Action vs Game		 > 3 Months 1280x720 15 MB
Live Action vs Game		 > 3 Months 1280x720 13 MB
Presentation: End of championship		 > 3 Months 640x360 85 MB
Presentation: End of championship		 > 3 Months 960x540 154 MB
Presentation: End of championship		 > 3 Months 960x540 191 MB
Snowy Quebec presentation		 > 3 Months 640x360 94 MB
Snowy Quebec presentation		 > 3 Months 640x360 94 MB
Snowy Quebec presentation		 > 3 Months 960x540 174 MB
Snowy Quebec presentation		 > 3 Months 960x540 174 MB
Snowy Quebec presentation		 > 3 Months 960x540 204 MB
Snowy Quebec presentation		 > 3 Months 960x540 204 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Audio Design		 > 3 Months 640x360 120 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Audio Design		 > 3 Months 640x360 120 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Audio Design		 > 3 Months 640x360 120 MB
Nürburgring under the snow, off screen		 > 3 Months 640x360 36 MB
Nürburgring under the snow, off screen		 > 3 Months 640x360 36 MB
Nürburgring under the snow, off screen		 > 3 Months 960x540 69 MB
Nürburgring under the snow, off screen		 > 3 Months 960x540 69 MB
Nürburgring under the snow, off screen		 > 3 Months 960x540 84 MB
Nürburgring under the snow, off screen		 > 3 Months 960x540 84 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Cities		 > 3 Months 640x360 275 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Cities		 > 3 Months 640x360 275 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Cities		 > 3 Months 1280x720 630 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Cities		 > 3 Months 1280x720 630 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Cities		 > 3 Months 1280x720 770 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Cities		 > 3 Months 1280x720 770 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Audio Design		 > 3 Months 640x360 106 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Audio Design		 > 3 Months 640x360 106 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Audio Design		 > 3 Months 640x360 158 MB
Gamersyde No Comment: Audio Design		 > 3 Months 640x360 158 MB
Cone Attack, Las Vegas		 > 3 Months 640x360 35 MB
Cone Attack, Las Vegas		 > 3 Months 640x360 35 MB
Cone Attack, Las Vegas		 > 3 Months 1280x720 117 MB
Cone Attack, Las Vegas		 > 3 Months 1280x720 117 MB
Cone Attack, Las Vegas		 > 3 Months 1280x720 132 MB
Cone Attack, Las Vegas		 > 3 Months 1280x720 132 MB
Shangai by night, motorbike		 > 3 Months 640x360 77 MB
Shangai by night, motorbike		 > 3 Months 640x360 77 MB
Shangai by night, motorbike		 > 3 Months 1280x720 237 MB
Shangai by night, motorbike		 > 3 Months 1280x720 237 MB
Shangai by night, motorbike		 > 3 Months 1280x720 296 MB
Shangai by night, motorbike		 > 3 Months 1280x720 296 MB
Saint Petersburg in the fog on a bike		 > 3 Months 640x360 49 MB
Saint Petersburg in the fog on a bike		 > 3 Months 640x360 49 MB
Saint Petersburg in the fog on a bike		 > 3 Months 1280x720 154 MB
Saint Petersburg in the fog on a bike		 > 3 Months 1280x720 154 MB
Saint Petersburg in the fog on a bike		 > 3 Months 1280x720 230 MB
Saint Petersburg in the fog on a bike		 > 3 Months 1280x720 230 MB
Direct feed intro		 > 3 Months 640x360 52 MB
Direct feed intro		 > 3 Months 640x360 52 MB
Direct feed intro		 > 3 Months 1280x720 130 MB
Direct feed intro		 > 3 Months 1280x720 130 MB
Direct feed intro		 > 3 Months 1280x720 145 MB
Direct feed intro		 > 3 Months 1280x720 145 MB
Snowy Quebec		 > 3 Months 640x360 33 MB
Snowy Quebec		 > 3 Months 640x360 33 MB
Snowy Quebec		 > 3 Months 640x360 33 MB
Snowy Quebec		 > 3 Months 1280x720 110 MB
Snowy Quebec		 > 3 Months 1280x720 110 MB
Snowy Quebec		 > 3 Months 1280x720 110 MB
Snowy Quebec		 > 3 Months 1280x720 87 MB
Snowy Quebec		 > 3 Months 1280x720 87 MB
Snowy Quebec		 > 3 Months 1280x720 87 MB
GC07: Intro		 > 3 Months 640x360 56 MB
GC07: Intro		 > 3 Months 960x540 104 MB
GC07: Intro		 > 3 Months 960x540 119 MB
E3: Offscreen gameplay		 > 3 Months 960x540 69 MB
E3: MSFT PGR4 gameplay		 > 3 Months 960x540 74 MB
E3: MSFT PGR4 gameplay		 > 3 Months 960x540 74 MB
E3: Marketplace trailer		 > 3 Months 1280x720 85 MB
E3: Marketplace trailer		 > 3 Months 1280x720 85 MB
E3: Games montage		 > 3 Months 320x240 19 MB
St Peters Rain		 > 3 Months 1280x720 46 MB
X06: Teaser		 > 3 Months 640x360 8 MB
 
Gallery		 Since Number of images
DLC images		 > 3 Months 8
DLC images		 > 3 Months 11
4 DLC images		 > 3 Months 4
16 images		 > 3 Months 16
16 images		 > 3 Months 16
1 image		 > 3 Months 1
2 photo mode images		 > 3 Months 2
11 photo mode images		 > 3 Months 11
Arcade mode + 2 photo mode images		 > 3 Months 4
Un image		 > 3 Months 1
Interface + Photo mode image		 > 3 Months 4
Images		 > 3 Months 9
Game Convention images		 > 3 Months 6
All environments		 > 3 Months 1
E3 images		 > 3 Months 13
Bike (video?) captures		 > 3 Months 5
Bike images		 > 3 Months 12
The weather system		 > 3 Months 30
A mysterious city		 > 3 Months 1
Quebec City		 > 3 Months 10
4 images		 > 3 Months 4
3 images		 > 3 Months 3
First 12 official screenshots		 > 3 Months 12
 
News		 Since
PGR4 content pack released		 > 3 Months
PGR4 DLC Pack announced		 > 3 Months
Bizarre Creations interview		 > 3 Months
The first 10 minutes: PGR4		 > 3 Months
PGR4: Live Action vs Game		 > 3 Months
PGR4: Even more video		 > 3 Months
PGR4: Snowy gameplay		 > 3 Months
No Comment: PGR4 cities		 > 3 Months
Gamersyde No Comment: PGR4 audio design		 > 3 Months
More PGR4 gameplay		 > 3 Months
Direct Feed PGR4 intro video		 > 3 Months
Direct feed PGR4 gameplay		 > 3 Months
PGR 4 goes Gold !		 > 3 Months
One PGR4 image		 > 3 Months
2 PGR4 images		 > 3 Months
PGR4, back already		 > 3 Months
One PGR4 image		 > 3 Months
PGR4's interface detailed		 > 3 Months
PGR4 images		 > 3 Months
GC07: PGR4 Intro video		 > 3 Months
PGR4: Gameplay and features		 > 3 Months
GC07: PGR4 images		 > 3 Months
PGR4 screenshots montage		 > 3 Months
E3: PGR4 gameplay video		 > 3 Months
E3: Xbox 360 games montage		 > 3 Months
E3: Demo and trailer of PGR4		 > 3 Months
The bikes in Project Gotham Racing 4		 > 3 Months
One PGR4 screen, and a lot more!		 > 3 Months
Quebec City in PGR4?		 > 3 Months
4 Project Gotham Racing 4 images		 > 3 Months
Project Gotham Racing 4 images		 > 3 Months
Images and video of PGR4		 > 3 Months
X06: PGR4 teaser		 > 3 Months
<< 1 ... 5 6
Author Message
LEBATO

IS WRONG LEBATO - IS WRONG
Since 1300 Days

2007-08-01 18:50:01 In reply to GriftGFX (2007-08-01 18:40:46)

Posted by GriftGFX
Yup, beautiful! I'd say that's good enough, when it comes to different lighting conditions, although I would have preferred to see the difference extend to night and day. Still, stunning visuals!
Yeah, good enough is a good way to put it.

Phaethon360

Mr Pantsies Phaethon360 - Mr Pant<s>s</s>ies
Since 1024 Days

2007-08-01 21:22:29

You guys complaining about a good looking game? Sigh.

I'm glad we can't race at night. I'm scared of the dark. Oh God. My text is in the dark! HALP!

---
Phaethon, the forum Spectre.

GriftGFX

He can also
ban your ass! GriftGFX - He can also<br>ban your ass!
Since 1178 Days

2007-08-01 21:28:46

We can race at night -- but on night time tracks, we can't race in the day light! I think we're complaining because a feature of PGR3 has now gone missing.. but we're also acknowledging that it's been replaced by other features and content so it's more forgivable.
LEBATO

IS WRONG LEBATO - IS WRONG
Since 1300 Days

2007-08-02 00:43:12 In reply to GriftGFX (2007-08-01 21:28:46)

Posted by GriftGFX
We can race at night -- but on night time tracks, we can't race in the day light! I think we're complaining because a feature of PGR3 has now gone missing.. but we're also acknowledging that it's been replaced by other features and content so it's more forgivable.
Yeah, I wouldn't even call it complaining. It's just disappointing.

GrimThorne

GrimThorne
Since 1050 Days

2007-08-02 01:49:38 In reply to LEBATO (2007-08-01 18:23:42)

Posted by LEBATO
Ok more info from Bizarre, they try to clear things up a bit. You can read about it here:

http://www.bizarrecreations.com/article.php?articl...
LEBATO, While I did enjoy the discussions that came from the topic you created, I have to say that given Bizarre's response that you seemed to have created a "Storm in a Tea Cup" over the DVD9 issue. lol

Bizarre's solution isn't one I would have chosen, but it works and the results are quite impressive.

Sometimes you have to give the developer an opportunity to explain their position before you run into a forum declaring "huge dissapointment" Although I know you weren't attacking Bizzarre, only the DVD9 format.
GriftGFX

He can also
ban your ass! GriftGFX - He can also<br>ban your ass!
Since 1178 Days

2007-08-02 02:01:38 In reply to GrimThorne (2007-08-02 01:49:38)

Posted by GrimThorne
LEBATO, While I did enjoy the discussions that came from the topic you created, I have to say that given Bizarre's response that you seemed to have created a "Storm in a Tea Cup" over the DVD9 issue. lol

Bizarre's solution isn't one I would have chosen, but it works and the results are quite impressive.

Sometimes you have to give the developer an opportunity to explain their position before you run into a forum declaring "huge dissapointment" Although I know you weren't attacking Bizzarre, only the DVD9 format.
It does look great. Maybe I should change the topic title to, "Minor, insignificant disappointment!" ;P
SimonM7

SimonM7
Since 1201 Days

2007-08-02 02:13:29

Well, if I recall right we lost a couple of settings from 2 in 3 too. Or maybe it was from 1 to 2...

I think there was like day, night and dawn/dusk? Or did I dream that?
LEBATO

IS WRONG LEBATO - IS WRONG
Since 1300 Days

2007-08-02 06:28:04 In reply to GrimThorne (2007-08-02 01:49:38)

Posted by GrimThorne
LEBATO, While I did enjoy the discussions that came from the topic you created, I have to say that given Bizarre's response that you seemed to have created a "Storm in a Tea Cup" over the DVD9 issue. lol

Bizarre's solution isn't one I would have chosen, but it works and the results are quite impressive.

Sometimes you have to give the developer an opportunity to explain their position before you run into a forum declaring "huge dissapointment" Although I know you weren't attacking Bizzarre, only the DVD9 format.
Well they didn't have to clear anything to me, I understood things when Ben first said it. Whatever they say, DVD9 did limit the game, and whatever they say, it is a huge disappointment for me. Of course that's not to say the game doesn't impress me anyways.
ItsOK_ImaNinja

ItsOK_ImaNinja
Since 492 Days

2007-08-02 13:47:09 In reply to Acert93 (2007-08-01 04:02:56)

Posted by Acert93
You have no clue what you are talking about.
Parallax mapping is vertex shading intensive, not pixel.
It generates geometry and requires a tessellation unit in order for it to be processed in a single pass.
Both of these statements are incorrect and your followup obfuscates your original statements with even more foggy information.

Parallax Mapping is not pixel shader light / vertex shader heavy, and it doesn't require a tesselation unit.
In the new world of unified shaders, it's best to just call it shading - I guess.
Unified shaders is hardware resource model to adapting [essentially] math units [shaders] for a broader range of computations; current shader models still make clear distinctions between pixel shader code, vertex shader code, and geometry shader code.

Unified shaders is a hardware implimentation that has not obscured the distinction between vertex and pixel processing (or ROP processing either) in the way you are suggesting.

Virtex shading deals with vertices (geometry) and pixel shading deals with pixels. Vertex shaders can use textures (vertex shading, R2VB) to augment real geometry; pixel shaders can use textures (various bump maps like normals and parallax maps) to augment pixels to appear to represent geometry -- hence drawing flush to geometry with a parallax map will clearly show the geometry hasn't been altered.

Edit: Wiki is your friend (as it seems you don't believe me).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Displacement_mapping
Displacement mapping is an alternative technique in contrast to bump mapping, normal mapping, and parallax mapping, using a (procedural-) texture- or height map to cause an effect where the actual geometric position of points over the textured surface are displaced, often along the local surface normal, according to the value the texture function evaluates to at each point on the surface. It gives surfaces a great sense of depth and detail, permitting in particular self-occlusion, self-shadowing and silhouettes; on the other hand, it is the most costly of this class of techniques owing to the large amount of additional geometry.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallax_mapping
Parallax Mapping (also, Offset Mapping or Virtual Displacement Mapping) is an enhancement of the bump mapping or normal mapping techniques applied to textures in 3D rendering applications such as video games (including open source games like Sauerbraten). To the end user, this means that textures such as wooden floorboards will have more apparent depth and realism with less of an influence on the performance of the game. Parallax mapping was introduced by Kaneko, T., et al[1] in 2001.

Parallax mapping is implemented by displacing the texture coordinates at a point on the rendered polygon by a function of the view angle in tangent space (the angle relative to the surface normal) and the value of the height map at that point. At steeper view angles the texture coordinates are displaced more, and so give the illusion of depth due to parallax effects as the view changes.

Parallax mapping described by Kaneko is a single step process that does not account for occlusion. Subsequent enhancements have been made to the algorithm incorporating iterative approaches to allow for occlusion and accurate silhouette rendering[2].
Please do not pretend to be an expert on the subject. I can quote wiki too, and you are confusing yourself over terms.
Posted by Wiki
Requirements

Stable real bump mapping requires either a built in shader programming unit on the GPU (vertex shader) or a dedicated vector processing unit connected to the GPU. The GPU must also have multi-pass rendering capabilities or bump mapping will be the only type of texture effect available due to a two texture layer limit.

The Emotion Engine on the Sony PlayStation 2 is an example of handling bump mapping through a vector processing unit. Sony included 2 vector processors rather than a GPU shader that could be used for bump mapping operations. The system could calculate height maps independently while the per-pixel calculations were carried out in one of the vector processing units. Unfortunately this capability was not used much until nearly the end of the system's life cycle with games such as Hitman: Blood Money[1].

Most other systems, including the Sony PlayStation 3, Microsoft Xbox, Microsoft Xbox 360, and most PC graphics cards do bump mapping using pixel shaders.
So you see, real bump mapping uses vertex shaders. Faster methods run on pixels shaders.

You are confusing yourself over terms. You need to make clear distinctions between methods in your points.

I already explained the terms I was using and how I was using them. If you want to ignore them and all we are doing is arguing over terms.

We won't come to proper analysis if you do not define what you mean when you use terms like bump mapping. Obviously you believe it to be a pixel shader process.

I'm telling you that it is not - but also that the effect can be run on pixel shaders.

I can't explain that any simpler.
LEBATO

IS WRONG LEBATO - IS WRONG
Since 1300 Days

2007-08-03 04:51:08

Uh oh, time to use my new pic.
GriftGFX

He can also
ban your ass! GriftGFX - He can also<br>ban your ass!
Since 1178 Days

2007-08-03 05:11:31

More like, "Caution: Misinformation ahead!"
LEBATO

IS WRONG LEBATO - IS WRONG
Since 1300 Days

2007-08-03 05:13:28 In reply to GriftGFX (2007-08-03 05:11:31)

Posted by GriftGFX
More like, "Caution: Misinformation ahead!"
Which will probably end up with things getting ugly :P
newbielives

Since 1117 Days

2007-08-03 17:38:26 In reply to ItsOK_ImaNinja (2007-08-01 01:22:44)

Since you call a pixel shader a vertex shader because its using vector math then in your world there is only a vertex shader ? because I can't think of a time when I didn't use Vector math in a pixel shader.

Posted by ItsOK_ImaNinja
Parallax mapping is vertex shading intensive, not pixel.
Posted by ItsOK_ImaNinja
Most other systems, including the Sony PlayStation 3, Microsoft Xbox, Microsoft Xbox 360, and most PC graphics cards do bump mapping using pixel shaders.
Posted by ItsOK_ImaNinja
I prefer to call it vertex shading, as the core math is vector math. But there is nothing wrong with calling it pixel shading, as the most intensive part if pixel shading.

In the new world of unified shaders, it's best to just call it shading - I guess.

All forms of bump mapping, including parallax require vertex shading, which is basically heavier as you move towards parallax mapping.

And I see that the old play on words of confusion is at it again.

To clear things up:

Parallax Mapping = Displacement mapping
Virtual Displacement mapping = somebody just made that up - it's a dirty fast way of doing Parallax mapping, which is the same as Displacement mapping.

You could also call Virtual Displacement mapping = Virtual Parallax mapping

Now people have taken to calling parallax mapping the dirty fast way of doing displacement mapping, which you appear to be doing - but forgive me for saying, that is just wrong.

As far as I can remember:

Parallax Mapping = Displacement mapping
Parallax Mapping != Virtual Displacement mapping

Virtual Parallax Mapping = Virtual Displacement mapping

Make sense?
JXB

JXB
Since 510 Days

2007-08-03 17:52:26

This thread got good.
ItsOK_ImaNinja

ItsOK_ImaNinja
Since 492 Days

2007-08-04 19:02:54 In reply to newbielives (2007-08-03 17:38:26)

Posted by newbielives
Since you call a pixel shader a vertex shader because its using vector math then in your world there is only a vertex shader ? because I can't think of a time when I didn't use Vector math in a pixel shader.
No I think you took my words out of context. That is why we have unified shaders, because from a capabilities differences pixel shaders and vertex shaders are very close to each other. It's a hop and a skip to turn one into the other.

Obviously, a pixel shader can be used to apply a pixel only affect like a screen filter for example, or even AA.

But the same can be accomplished by using a vertex shader - its all about how you approach the task.

Shaders are just specialized processors that handle certain types of tasks really well.

There's nothing that a shader can do that a normal processor can't do slower.
<< 1 ... 5 6
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