Even if they could get it to 1080p 60fps, which I'm sure they certainly could, I would still prefer 720p at 60fps with a more attractive game overall. And it wouldn't just be for looks, either, the game itself could be even better without having to bother with 1080p. I think to target 1080p on either of these consoles, even if at 30fps, would be a gross mismanagement of the available power provided by these two machines. And the majority of people out there still use 720p over 1080p on their televisions. I feel it makes much more sense to save the explicit targeting of 1080p for the generation after the 720 and ps4.

In the absence of pictures, the best we can do is talk about things, unfortunately.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSmYVu6tjbw

Just let this hold you over till then :P

God that watchdogs looks shit.

by the generation after the PS4/720 i think the consoles will be tageting ultra HD. if it kicks off of course.

i think if games next gen arn't 1080p it'll be a massive mistake on their part, i doubt they'd do it, i think we'll still be seeing 720p(if not sub HD)/30fps since it'll allow for more visual niceties, but you'd think given the fact most people with HD tv's have FULL HD tvs they'd aim for that. start of this gen HD tv's where HD ready, they where 720p. and the ONLY reason we still use 720p on our 1080p TV sets, is becasue that's all we CAN use on them...if we're lucky. i'd rather have a sacrifice to framerate (solid 30fps) then a sacrifice to resolution.

I would not be surprised if Sony will show Gran Turismo 5 4k, running on a PS4, similar to Gran Turismo HD back in the days...

The PS 4 will not be able to run brand new games with 4k, but if they rerelease some of PS3's best games on ultra HD, it might be used to push their telly-departement.

@Optimus 720p is allready outdated. Full HD TVs became very cheap lately, modern smart phones have better resolutions and I expect 4k TVs to access the mass market within the life-cycle of the next gen consoles...

They will push 1080p game just for the sake of it.

i think as long as it's locked at 30 it's fine. i really don;t see the difference playing something like killzone or rage for instance. it's when it fluctuates it becomes an issue. so if they keep their games locked at 30FPS think it's perfectly fine. we certainly don't NEED framerates pushing 120fps, or even 60 for that matter.

30fps is shit when 60fps gets experienced no matter genre. And Killzone HIGHLY needs 60fps or atleast 40 or something.
With the way that slow clunky weighty game played in KZ2 and 3, 30fps is unacceptable, it could barely keep 30fps to begin with.

IMO it should be like this...either, 1080p/50-40fps or 720p/60fps locked. Visuals being leaps and bounds what this gen ever done. (on consoles).

Dont say "we" since I am sure once everyone experience 60fps nobody would like to go less than that nobody would agree with you.
I mean hell look at tht DmC game. On console its not 60fps but once PC shows up and showed how 60fps was like you could never enjoy console version anymore.

For me going from COD framerate to BF3/Killzone type, its just bad.

God all this "i want 1080p 60fps standard" just makes me want to build my pc faster..

If it aint 1080p 60fps then something is wrong... very very wrong.

It wont be 1080p60, no way in hell. Especially if its only a 1.2TF gpu in the 720. 1080p30 is far more realistic, most pc's have been pushing 1080p quite easily at 30fps for years even on ultra settings so whatever mobile gpu they use should be able to at least match that. 60fps at that res you need something much meatier unless you want it looking like a ps2 game.

I am fine with 30fps and a little motion blur.

Let me explain:
I want my games to look movie-like and imo playing games with 60fps kind of feels like watching HD movies with this strange soap opera effect.
Hard to describe, but 60fps games run too smooth for my likes...it might be useful for first person shooter if you turn around 180 degrees real quick and see everything crispyly clear, but thats not realistic. Turn around in real life and while turning you only see a blurry mess, until you focus again...

its a video game, dont compare that to real life. If you continue to dot hat then you are constantly having the wrong way of thinking of things.

60fps is great for racing, shooters, action games...those 3 are the main genres that 60fps really gets it goin for.
And no it doesnt look like a opera effect...its a GAME not a movie.

Motion blur is an artifact produced by filming in 24 fps, so not something you'd generally experience while looking at something in reality i think :P

Also i think motion blur in games generally looks terrible.

As much as MS likes dropping cash, I'm suprised they never jumped at Leap Motion's tech, to further their Kinect Initiative for the next gen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pl1k5klI8XU

See, 60fps fps is incredible. I completely understand the desire to have that in all of our games, but mark my words when I say it will simply never be a top priority for a lot of console developers unless their title is of a nature where they can afford it while getting the game to look just the way they like, or they absolutely make the decision that 60fps, regardless of visuals, is a must and then they'll have to build around that fact.

1080p @ 60fps is even less likely. For me, honestly, most games at 30fps are simply unacceptable. It has to be a certain kind of game for me to ever really accept 30fps. In fact, I usually hate playing games at anything below, at the very least, 60fps. However, these are strict requirements that I only ever seem to more consistently impose on pc gaming, and not so much consoles. It's far less important for me on consoles. I'm sure we would all love for our console games to be at 60fps, but the reality is that most console games, especially nowadays, will see their developer opt to make a more visually impressive game that targets 30fps simply because they feel -- most of them feel -- that a more attractive game that does more to grab your attention will have a stronger chance of selling better. The more power console developers get their hands on, the more tempting it will always be for them to say, "you know what, let's just go for 30fps and make it look better." Or, in some cases, it's never really just about making something that looks better, it's usually them rationalizing their decision by saying, "we can make a better game at half the frame rate." That's just the nature of the beast.

Pretty much, the only place where 60fps is practically a must on a console the majority of the time is with sports, racing titles and fighters. However, as has been pointed out before by Grift, and maybe it's just a coincidence (or maybe it isn't), the best selling game franchise of this entire generation just so happens to be a 60fps shooter, Call of Duty. While I'm not very fond of call of duty these days, I do get excited at the thought of games, such as Uncharted or even Halo 5 releasing in 60fps. I may not mind console games being at 30fps, but I'm also not entirely ignorant of just how much the feel and smoothness or speed of 60fps can do to enhance a game experience, more so than a lot of folks may appreciate. Heck, more so than even I myself might appreciate at times. Maybe because we've become so accepting of 30fps on console titles, if a brave dev should decide to take that step, a lot of us might probably be wondering just how much better it might have looked if only the developer decided to use 30fps instead? Or maybe a developer's game ends up not selling as expected, and they decide to pinpoint the precise cause for why a competitor did better as being that competitor's decision to sacrifice the extra 30fps to make their game look even more spectacular. It's a very tough balance, especially on the console side where budgets tend to be larger. It might just be too soon for these for these upcoming consoles to get away with targeting 60fps without a potential consequence of their doing so. And to add one more thing, the reality of the matter is, even if there were more 60fps titles, not many of them would find Call of Duty level success regardless of how good they were, and not many devs want to find themselves in the position where they feel they've left anything on the table, nor do they want to risk countless other games looking more misleadingly spectacular, thus giving off the impression that their title and studio simply isn't up to snuff with the competition. It's tough.

The business model of the console space with respect to the power that the new machines will have, and due to the fact that we aren't exactly yet at the point of diminishing returns on graphical impressiveness, may just make it too impractical to make 60fps, much less 60fps at 1080p a top priority. I think there's a reason Carmack (was it carmack?) told everyone to expect a lot of 720p 30 titles this upcoming gen. I believe it was Carmack that said that.You might be underestimating next gen Kinect just a tad. I'm willing to bet the new Kinect is capable of all this and then some. One thing's certain about a next gen Kinect: They're probably going to come to as close to going all out as you can get.

If they can pull this off http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-w... with way better graphics, its fine with me.

I want Crysis 3 Ultra settings 1080p/30fps if not 60fps if they can pull that off.

These two images are what i want for PS4, 1080p
http://images.gamersyde.com/image_crysis_3-20972-2...
http://images.gamersyde.com/image_crysis_3-20972-2...

Not sure you realize how low you're setting the bar :) I think both the next xbox and playstation easily exceed those 2 examples. Will they do so at 1080p 60fps? I doubt that. 1080p 30fps? Most likely.

However, I anticipate a lot of games rendering at 720p and then simply upscaling. It might be their best hope of doing all the new and crazy things that they surely want to do, while getting in the kind of AF and AA that they want. I mean, that is, of course, people are happy with and want to see a lot of 1080p titles that may be jag fests or that are using very cheap, horrible looking AA, and that are possibly going cheap on the AF or draw distances.

I still personally feel that 720p is the sweet spot for next gen, but then maybe I myself am underestimating just how powerful these things will be, and I already think they'll be pretty damn powerful. Prediction. Uncharted 4 and Halo 5 will both stomp Crysis 3 visually. And god forbid they don't, something I highly doubt, then Halo 6 and Uncharted 5 will. But what's more likely to happen is that, likely, well before those games are even ready, you'll be seeing the writing on the wall regarding the strength of these two machines. Be ready for it.

Man, I want a next gen Blue Dragon so fucking bad :(

Meh, as long as i can play Crysis 3 like that on my full Hd on a console I am happy.
I may have low bar but atleast i dont go crazy high, just incase i dont get dissapointed when they start showing lol. (especially when i dont know anything about specs and what is revealed).

I have seen 1080p Crysis 2 maxed out with DX11 from PC to a big HDTV, looks fantastic, and when i saw that playthrough of Crysis 3, visually it looks fantastic. So if they can go beyond that, the better.

But 1080p is no doubt the "sweet spot" for next gen and thats how it should be. 720p was for this gen but not alot of games could even do that without sacrificing visuals and framerate or something, so to ask next gen to be 720p instead of 1080p is lower than my expectations.

Shake your hand in front of your face...real life motion blur. 60fps games with no motion blur tend to look way too sterile. Like the hobbit HFR version. rather it be there then not, same with DOF (when done right). 60 fps is overrated though. Locked 30 is all i need, and given the dev paterns of the current gen, thats exactly what i'll get, so i'm happy. Every single game released this gen could have been 60 fps, they chose not to so they could make said games look nicer. That won't change next gen. i'd love vsync enabled on all games too, but i'd be a moron to believe that will be the case. Vsync is just something a dev can sacrifice to make a game run smoother or look nicer. And thats exactly what they will do.

If you could have a game that looks, in no small part, quite a bit better because it's rendering internally at 720 as opposed to 1080p on the next gen xbox or ps4, wouldn't you gladly accept that over a game that looks worse, but runs at 1080p?

I really don't see the fuss over 1080p. 720p still looks fantastic. I repeat, still looks fantastic for games. I don't know why developers wouldn't sprint to make their games 720p just to further take advantage of all the extra power available on these new machines.

It's not that I think they are weak. I think they are insanely powerful. I just think why waste what I believe are unnecessary resources on going 1080p over 720p? I don't know, I may be in small company, but draw distance can be better at 720p, AA and AF can surely be better than in 1080p. Lighting and other effects can be better, and so much more. Shadows will certainly be better if they opted for 720p. Remember the lighting and shadowing in Alan Wake? Much better than that game did with lighting and shadowing can be standard in all next gen PS4 and Xbox games. Why would we turn away from that for 1080p!? :P

These next gen pr wars over who is doing 1080p and who isn't will only hurt the games, I feel. Put it like this, I'm willing to take 720p 60fps for ALL ps4 and next xbox games before I take 1080p 30 or 1080p 60.

Forcing 1080p on these machines would be like chaining them to a steel post with only 5 feet of rope. I want Durango Unchained :p

Tell me something: If every xbox 720 and ps4 game were a guaranteed 60fps, but were 720p titles, would you still want 1080p, which is almost certainly guaranteed to make a ton of games 30fps still?

What is more important to you all? 60fps in all games or 1080p resolution for all games. Which do you guys hold higher on the must have list? I'm curious.

Which of the two would you less be willing to sacrifice sooner than the other? 60fps or 1080p?