The XbOne Yard

Since 5933 Days

Posted by Tomarru

You don't seem to understand how BC works. A dedicated chip is dedicated to running it exactly as it runs on the 360, it is running on a 360, there is no extra hardware to devote to it. Emulation, how the 360 runs xbox games, they are using the 360 hardware to run the xbox game which allows them to edit the parameters of how it runs and use the 360 hardware itself to boost the resolution or framerate.

If as we expect, the durango uses a dedicated chip then when you run a 360 game on it the durango hardware is essentially asleep or performing hardware upscaling. The game is still running on 360 hardware and limited to how the 360 itself would run it.

You may be right. It might just be like 360 without any enhancement. That would not be too big deal then. As it will replace just that box so instead of having 2 only one will be required.

In reply to

GriftGFX

Since 7576 Days

It's a pretty big deal to early adopters. This is especially true when you consider the 360's incredible attach rate. It's also critical for the forward viability of Xbox Live Arcade. Which could be a big deal to the marketing for the new 360 as well.

Cross platform arcade titles, anyone?

Yeah. No big deal. :|

In reply to

Jollipop

Since 7459 Days

Posted by GriftGFX

The completely unsubstantiated rumor on a device that hasn't even been announced, yes.

The guy that leaked the rumour has been spot on with "some" of the things he's leaked, I wouldn't be surprised if they go this route, I personally see little value in XBL.

That being said I do think that if its true Sony should think about doing something similar with PSN+.

Also if MS can guarantee an extended warranty over the 2 years subscription it would go a long way to ease early adopters minds after the 360's RROD problems.

In reply to

Marumaro for the WIN !!

Phaethon360

Since 7422 Days

https://twitter.com/thurrott/status/33032805205373...
https://twitter.com/tomwarren/status/3303281910781...

Paul Thurrot and Tom Warren confirm and adjust price rumor. $299 bundle will requre 2yr $15/mo Xbox Live subscription. So in total it's $660. If you're already buying it on a credit card why not just buy the $499 one.

In reply to

Optimusv2

Since 7468 Days

Posted by KORNdog

but how would kinect be a better alternative to a pad, even in terms of a slow paced, turn based JRPG? they're usually menu based, a list of options you select and watch as they play out on screen. kinect would work, but it wouldn't be a better/quicker/more intuative alternative to a pad, certainly not when you have to put your pad down to do it, so what's the benefit, other then some lame novelty value?. pressing up and down and "A" or "X" to select options works perfectly, kinect just slows things dow and introduces more issues then it solves. even menu navigation using kinect on the dash is a much slower method of control. you have to "hover" over what you want to select before it registers it as a selected option and not movement. i just don't see it working....ever. but then it doesn't need to. dancing games and kinect sport-like experiences will be enough. they rake in the cash and that's all MS care about. and the more seperate those things remain, the better. otherwise we're going to get a lot of games like steel battalion, games that are too core for the casuals, and too broken for the core.

The argument you're using now could just as easily have been used against the Nintendo DS with its dual screen and use of a stylus (and it more or less was). It's always simpler and seemingly faster to keep doing things as we've always been doing them, until we actually try something new and realize that it isn't as cumbersome as people think it is when properly designed for. Also, I'm not referring to a hovering mechanic where you use Kinect to select an attack from a set of options, far from it. Under what I'm describing, you basically already selected the attack using the controller as you would in any jrpg, but if it's a Kinect hand gesture based skill, a set of hand gesture commands for the selected skill show up on the screen, and the player simply has to match those sequence of gesture commands using their hands.

Don't think of it necessarily as being the same as using Kinect to control the dashboard, think of it as being similar to how dance central works, but without the dancing, you're just using your hands. Once you match a certain pattern, you are presented with the next pattern in the list, and the game doesn't always have to give the player an unlimited amount of time to get this right. Some skills can have a requirement to be competed within a certain amount of time. Or maybe there can be rewards for players who have a skill's gesture patterns so well memorized that they don't even need to wait to see all the on screen prompts, like maybe there is boosted attack power or greater spell effectiveness, increased area of effect, that sorta thing. And maybe as you level up or something, you achieve a level of mastery over a skill that allows you then use a shortcut gesture perform a normally more complex set of gestures.

In reply to

[quote=KORNdog]

but how would kinect be a better alternative to a pad, even in terms of a slow paced, turn based JRPG? they're usually menu based, a list of options you select and watch as they play out on screen. kinect would work, but it wouldn't be a better/quicker/more intuative alternative to a pad, certainly not when you have to put your pad down to do it, so what's the benefit, other then some lame novelty value?. pressing up and down and "A" or "X" to select options works perfectly, kinect just slows things dow and introduces more issues then it solves. even menu navigation using kinect on the dash is a much slower method of control. you have to "hover" over what you want to select before it registers it as a selected option and not movement. i just don't see it working....ever. but then it doesn't need to. dancing games and kinect sport-like experiences will be enough. they rake in the cash and that's all MS care about. and the more seperate those things remain, the better. otherwise we're going to get a lot of games like steel battalion, games that are too core for the casuals, and too broken for the core.[/quote]

The argument you're using now could just as easily have been used against the Nintendo DS with its dual screen and use of a stylus (and it more or less was). It's always simpler and seemingly faster to keep doing things as we've always been doing them, until we actually try something new and realize that it isn't as cumbersome as people think it is when properly designed for. Also, I'm not referring to a hovering mechanic where you use Kinect to select an attack from a set of options, far from it. Under what I'm describing, you basically already selected the attack using the controller as you would in any jrpg, but if it's a Kinect hand gesture based skill, a set of hand gesture commands for the selected skill show up on the screen, and the player simply has to match those sequence of gesture commands using their hands.

Don't think of it necessarily as being the same as using Kinect to control the dashboard, think of it as being similar to how dance central works, but without the dancing, you're just using your hands. Once you match a certain pattern, you are presented with the next pattern in the list, and the game doesn't always have to give the player an unlimited amount of time to get this right. Some skills can have a requirement to be competed within a certain amount of time. Or maybe there can be rewards for players who have a skill's gesture patterns so well memorized that they don't even need to wait to see all the on screen prompts, like maybe there is boosted attack power or greater spell effectiveness, increased area of effect, that sorta thing. And maybe as you level up or something, you achieve a level of mastery over a skill that allows you then use a shortcut gesture perform a normally more complex set of gestures.

Halo Reach using 360 tesselation unit extensively.

Hironobu Sakaguchi is coming back to reclaim the throne :)

Seeing it in motion on your HDTV, will blow your mind!!

Don't ask any questions just shut up and buy Halo : Ghosts of the Onyx one of th

scoobs0688

Since 6211 Days

That sounds atrocious.

In reply to

add me on steam: scoobs18@gmail.com
add me on PSN: scoobs0688

Currently playing: Counterstrike:GO, Skyrim, WoW:MoP, SC2

KORNdog

Since 6980 Days

Posted by scoobs0688

That sounds atrocious.

I was thinking the same thing.

In reply to

Phaethon360

Since 7422 Days

Posted by Optimusv2

The argument you're using now could just as easily have been used against the Nintendo DS with its dual screen and use of a stylus (and it more or less was). It's always simpler and seemingly faster to keep doing things as we've always been doing them, until we actually try something new and realize that it isn't as cumbersome as people think it is when properly designed for. Also, I'm not referring to a hovering mechanic where you use Kinect to select an attack from a set of options, far from it. Under what I'm describing, you basically already selected the attack using the controller as you would in any jrpg, but if it's a Kinect hand gesture based skill, a set of hand gesture commands for the selected skill show up on the screen, and the player simply has to match those sequence of gesture commands using their hands.

Don't think of it necessarily as being the same as using Kinect to control the dashboard, think of it as being similar to how dance central works, but without the dancing, you're just using your hands. Once you match a certain pattern, you are presented with the next pattern in the list, and the game doesn't always have to give the player an unlimited amount of time to get this right. Some skills can have a requirement to be competed within a certain amount of time. Or maybe there can be rewards for players who have a skill's gesture patterns so well memorized that they don't even need to wait to see all the on screen prompts, like maybe there is boosted attack power or greater spell effectiveness, increased area of effect, that sorta thing. And maybe as you level up or something, you achieve a level of mastery over a skill that allows you then use a shortcut gesture perform a normally more complex set of gestures.

That idea stinks

In reply to

[quote=Optimusv2]

The argument you're using now could just as easily have been used against the Nintendo DS with its dual screen and use of a stylus (and it more or less was). It's always simpler and seemingly faster to keep doing things as we've always been doing them, until we actually try something new and realize that it isn't as cumbersome as people think it is when properly designed for. Also, I'm not referring to a hovering mechanic where you use Kinect to select an attack from a set of options, far from it. Under what I'm describing, you basically already selected the attack using the controller as you would in any jrpg, but if it's a Kinect hand gesture based skill, a set of hand gesture commands for the selected skill show up on the screen, and the player simply has to match those sequence of gesture commands using their hands.

Don't think of it necessarily as being the same as using Kinect to control the dashboard, think of it as being similar to how dance central works, but without the dancing, you're just using your hands. Once you match a certain pattern, you are presented with the next pattern in the list, and the game doesn't always have to give the player an unlimited amount of time to get this right. Some skills can have a requirement to be competed within a certain amount of time. Or maybe there can be rewards for players who have a skill's gesture patterns so well memorized that they don't even need to wait to see all the on screen prompts, like maybe there is boosted attack power or greater spell effectiveness, increased area of effect, that sorta thing. And maybe as you level up or something, you achieve a level of mastery over a skill that allows you then use a shortcut gesture perform a normally more complex set of gestures.[/quote]

That idea stinks

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/raP0GUS.gif[/IMG]

Eddy186

Since 7522 Days

Posted by Phaethon360

https://twitter.com/thurrott/status/330328052053733376
https://twitter.com/tomwarren/status/3303281910781...

Paul Thurrot and Tom Warren confirm and adjust price rumor. $299 bundle will requre 2yr $15/mo Xbox Live subscription. So in total it's $660. If you're already buying it on a credit card why not just buy the $499 one.

How much is Live without the $299 bundle?

In reply to

Tomarru

Since 6648 Days

$15 a month, same as it is right now. There will be new cards etc so dont expect to stockpule current yearly cards, they will want people to pay the highest amount possible.

In reply to

gow_fan

Since 5933 Days

Posted by GriftGFX

It's a pretty big deal to early adopters. This is especially true when you consider the 360's incredible attach rate. It's also critical for the forward viability of Xbox Live Arcade. Which could be a big deal to the marketing for the new 360 as well.

Cross platform arcade titles, anyone?

Yeah. No big deal. :|

May be it is not worth extra $ which increased the price of 720. Many may argue instead they could have spent on better gpu or faster ram ? They already have 360 for 360 games. For those who do not have 360 and probably will consider 720. BC may not big too much big deal for them as well.

In reply to

Optimusv2

Since 7468 Days

Posted by Phaethon360

That idea stinks

Posted by scoobs0688

That sounds atrocious.

You guys only think so because of one reason mostly.

You guys plain think turn based jrpgs in general are atrocious.

That's why a very basic addition as what I'm suggesting, something hardly radical and that is done in some ways already in existing jrpgs, is seen as such a terrible idea. The primary difference is that the jrpgs that use these kinds of things to bring a little something extra to the battle system, aren't doing so using a camera based system such as Kinect. However, Kinect is more than capable of being used pretty effectively as an extension of a turn based jrpg's battle system.

Lost Odyssey's ring system is a good example of this. Something along these lines can be created for Kinect, just involving hand gestures.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2008/01/03/lost-odysse...

The interesting part of the battle mechanics comes with the Aim Ring System. Close to the start of the game, you'll begin finding rings to equip to your party members. Each ring has its own set of effects that it can trigger during an attack. The Aim Ring System begins when you select the attack command. As your character dashes towards the enemy ranks, a ring will appear on the screen. When it does, holding down the left trigger activates a second ring. By releasing the left trigger the moment the targeting circle overlaps with the first ring, you'll maximize the ring's effect. Depending upon how good your timing is, you'll get a rating of bad, good or perfect. A bad rating essentially means that the ring enhancement has failed.

In a turn-based RPG, it's easy to zone out and ignore the combat on screen as you cycle through the menus. The Aim Ring System does its part to keep you involved, while still keeping the battle system simple and turn based. It also gives you a reason to take part in the item creation system in which you can assemble new rings to suit your needs.

I can easily see a Kinect hand gesture based system along these lines.

In reply to

[quote=Phaethon360]

That idea stinks

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/raP0GUS.gif[/IMG][/quote]

[quote=scoobs0688]That sounds atrocious.[/quote]

You guys only think so because of one reason mostly.

You guys plain think turn based jrpgs in general are atrocious.

That's why a very basic addition as what I'm suggesting, something hardly radical and that is done in some ways already in existing jrpgs, is seen as such a terrible idea. The primary difference is that the jrpgs that use these kinds of things to bring a little something extra to the battle system, aren't doing so using a camera based system such as Kinect. However, Kinect is more than capable of being used pretty effectively as an extension of a turn based jrpg's battle system.

Lost Odyssey's ring system is a good example of this. Something along these lines can be created for Kinect, just involving hand gestures.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2008/01/03/lost-odyssey-battle-overview

[quote]The interesting part of the battle mechanics comes with the Aim Ring System. Close to the start of the game, you'll begin finding rings to equip to your party members. Each ring has its own set of effects that it can trigger during an attack. [b]The Aim Ring System begins when you select the attack command. As your character dashes towards the enemy ranks, a ring will appear on the screen. When it does, holding down the left trigger activates a second ring. By releasing the left trigger the moment the targeting circle overlaps with the first ring, you'll maximize the ring's effect. Depending upon how good your timing is, you'll get a rating of bad, good or perfect. A bad rating essentially means that the ring enhancement has failed.[/b]

[b]In a turn-based RPG, it's easy to zone out and ignore the combat on screen as you cycle through the menus. The Aim Ring System does its part to keep you involved, while still keeping the battle system simple and turn based. It also gives you a reason to take part in the item creation system in which you can assemble new rings to suit your needs. [/b] 
[/quote]

I can easily see a Kinect hand gesture based system along these lines.

Halo Reach using 360 tesselation unit extensively.

Hironobu Sakaguchi is coming back to reclaim the throne :)

Seeing it in motion on your HDTV, will blow your mind!!

Don't ask any questions just shut up and buy Halo : Ghosts of the Onyx one of th

scoobs0688

Since 6211 Days

No, i think waving ur arms around to cast spells is an awful idea lol.

In reply to

add me on steam: scoobs18@gmail.com
add me on PSN: scoobs0688

Currently playing: Counterstrike:GO, Skyrim, WoW:MoP, SC2

Optimusv2

Since 7468 Days

Posted by scoobs0688

No, i think waving ur arms around to cast spells is an awful idea lol.

LOL quit making fun of me, damn it! :P It's not so much waving your hands around that I mean. This is what I mean, they just don't need to be this complex. Just a sequence of positions that your hands need to be in. Again, they do not have to be this complex. It isn't so much waving your arms around, but more like the system recognizing a success when you perform the required sign.

2 hands up, one closed into a fist, the other not.
2 hands up, 2 closed fists.
1 hand up, open hand
1 hand up, closed fist.
1 hand up, perform circular motion with open hand.
1 hand up, perform circular motion with closed fist.
2 hands up, place right hand on top of your left hand, using open hand for both.
2 hands up, place open right hand on top of closed left fist.

You get the idea

That's just a rough example of how simple the gestures can be. It doesn't have to be the player going nuts waving their hands every which way.

In reply to

[quote=scoobs0688]No, i think waving ur arms around to cast spells is an awful idea lol.[/quote]

LOL quit making fun of me, damn it! :P It's not so much waving your hands around that I mean. This is what I mean, they just don't need to be this complex. Just a sequence of positions that your hands need to be in. Again, they do not have to be this complex. It isn't so much waving your arms around, but more like the system recognizing a success when you perform the required sign.

[img]http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m8i8eylsfD1raf3v8o1_500.jpg[/img]

2 hands up, one closed into a fist, the other not.
2 hands up, 2 closed fists.
1 hand up, open hand
1 hand up, closed fist.
1 hand up, perform circular motion with open hand.
1 hand up, perform circular motion with closed fist.
2 hands up, place right hand on top of your left hand, using open hand for both.
2 hands up, place open right hand on top of closed left fist.

You get the idea

That's just a rough example of how simple the gestures can be. It doesn't have to be the player going nuts waving their hands every which way.

Halo Reach using 360 tesselation unit extensively.

Hironobu Sakaguchi is coming back to reclaim the throne :)

Seeing it in motion on your HDTV, will blow your mind!!

Don't ask any questions just shut up and buy Halo : Ghosts of the Onyx one of th

Phaethon360

Since 7422 Days

Posted by Tomarru

$15 a month, same as it is right now. There will be new cards etc so dont expect to stockpule current yearly cards, they will want people to pay the highest amount possible.

I don't know where you live but it is not $15. It's $8. Retail the cards are $60 a year but most often found around $50. That's paying more than triple the current price. If they do plan to raise all prices to that then there is no way in hell I'll ever get one.

In reply to

scoobs0688

Since 6211 Days

lmao where did u get that? I'm sorry I just don't think that sounds like something I'd ever want to do. I respect your idea, I just don't think its a good one.

In reply to

add me on steam: scoobs18@gmail.com
add me on PSN: scoobs0688

Currently playing: Counterstrike:GO, Skyrim, WoW:MoP, SC2

ManThatYouFear

Since 7519 Days

ram and tiger .. i think kinect would struggle with that.

i do love your passion Op and you never depleting enthusiasm for kinect, i just do not think you will ever see a turn based exclusive for xbox, they not even got ports of old ff games on there... and you can get them on everything.

unless that turnbased rpg has guns.. and cars.. and premium dlc skins and possibly a cat for the kids to stroke, awwwww.

In reply to

PSN:ManThatYouFear
GT: ManThatYouFear
Steam: Psn_ManThatYouFear
Real Life: ThatTwat

Sath

Since 7442 Days

I know only one hand gesture that Kinect might be able to get the idea, who knows maybe automatically shuts down the console...middle finger :P

In reply to

BLackHawkodst

Since 6463 Days

Posted by Phaethon360

I don't know where you live but it is not $15. It's $8. Retail the cards are $60 a year but most often found around $50. That's paying more than triple the current price. If they do plan to raise all prices to that then there is no way in hell I'll ever get one.

He is talking about the repayment price not the live price on its own, right now the same 2 yr $15 deal is running for the 360, that's what he means by its the same as it is now, No one knows what the price will be for live when you buy the console outright, the sub price is never going to work out cheaper as your taking it out on credit, so added interest will always make it more expensive.

In reply to

Prepare To Drop!!

Phaethon360

Since 7422 Days

Ah right. I forgot about that $99 4gb 360 bundle. Never knew they jacked the XBL that much.

I'm sure they'll get more people sucked in at Infinity launch with this deal though.

In reply to

BLackHawkodst

Since 6463 Days

True.

In reply to

Prepare To Drop!!

Jollipop

Since 7459 Days

Posted by ManThatYouFear

ram and tiger .. i think kinect would struggle with that..

But ... but but, Kinect 2.0

Yea and thats the thing, the $299 + subscription is designed for those who can't afford to lay out $499 in one go, I think it will work pretty well, of course they can go fuck themselves as far as I am concerned.

If Sony price more than $399 I'm not guna be happy lol.

In reply to

Marumaro for the WIN !!

GriftGFX

Since 7576 Days

I'm actually pretty amazed by how much some 360 skus still go for.

It will make a mini 360 at $99 seem like a better value than it actually is.

I'm also amazed that people still talk about potentials with Kinect. And then come up with the same bad ideas ;)

In reply to