2006-06-28 23:24:00 First Forza 2 screenshots? Come in a judge!!!

It does have a different look from that of the trailer, and I have no reason to believe that's not real time, still, very hard to judge from such small screens. What do you think?

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2006-06-28 23:39:05

looks very similar to the trailer, I think it iwll look great, but I wouldn't be surpised if those were psuedo-realtime promo shots.

2006-06-28 23:40:51

Well.... If they are in game? Bloody fantastic.

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2006-06-28 23:41:55

Where did you find these exactly? :)

Hmm official forza site... They look really good though to be honest :)

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[b] Never judge a game too harshly via screenshots or videos, because they are in no way capable of properly representing what the game truly looks like were you to see it running in front of you on a 360 [/b]

2006-06-28 23:43:54

Yeah, people are saying it's just different angles from the trailer, oh well. I don't remember seeing an evolution in the trailer, so I'll have to check again.

EDIT: I searched for more info on this and it seems like they are just different angles from the trailer, high-resolution shots of this will be put up most likely today. I need to see that Evo in high res :D Keep in mind these are in-game models, so that's how the model is going to look, at least physically, in-game.

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2006-06-29 01:00:33

The high resolution versions are in!!!

http://forzamotorsport.net/NR/rdonlyres/B13D5920-E...

http://forzamotorsport.net/NR/rdonlyres/0005BB2B-0...

http://forzamotorsport.net/NR/rdonlyres/806D982E-B...

http://forzamotorsport.net/NR/rdonlyres/D14416B2-4...

I'm kind of dissapointed really, those cars are obviously not very high in polygons. For example that Gallardo, the Lamborghini logo is just part of the paint, not a model as in PGR3. That Evo also dissapoints with all the poly edges. Everything else I'm not judging, only the car models.

But I guess they are "OK" since there will be 12 cars instead of the 8 in PGR3 (but then those had an interior), and 60fps instead of the 30fps in PGR3 AND damage, I don't know, maybe it's not a big deal once I have the game.

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2006-06-29 01:07:29

Are these even the actual screens of the game? :)

If they were they'd be all over IGN and other sites so I think its safe to say forza 2 will look better than what is shown here :)

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[b] Never judge a game too harshly via screenshots or videos, because they are in no way capable of properly representing what the game truly looks like were you to see it running in front of you on a 360 [/b]

2006-06-29 01:08:54 In reply to Optimusv2 (2006-06-29 01:07:29)

NO. The car models are the in-game car models though, that's what I'm judging. At least, that's what they said some time ago.

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2006-06-29 01:25:03

Yea I know what you mean I say give it time till when they eventually release official shots of the cars and other aspects of the game and we'll be pleased :)


A guy from the forza 2 team already said the trailer even though it has ingame assets the actual game looks alot better.

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[b] Never judge a game too harshly via screenshots or videos, because they are in no way capable of properly representing what the game truly looks like were you to see it running in front of you on a 360 [/b]

2006-06-29 02:16:49 In reply to Optimusv2 (2006-06-29 01:25:03)

Name 1 game that looked better than its game CGI.

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2006-06-29 02:27:00 In reply to Acert93 (2006-06-29 02:16:49)

Yeah, I'm going to need a link to that Optimus, I don't remember them ever saying that. The only thing they have said is that it will look better than PGR3.

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2006-06-29 02:41:28 In reply to Optimusv2 (2006-06-29 01:25:03)

no, what che said is that it is using in game assets and the look is "totally achievable"..
there's no way the game looks better thna the CGI, but it should look very good.

I've been playing quite a bit of forza lately, thne I picked up pgr3 again after a month layoff and was completely blown away by the graphics. it'll look better than PGR3 I think its safe to assume, but we'll have to wait till we actually see it.

2006-06-29 02:59:50

Haha well here comes the link.

N3's realtime cutscene characters look better than the cg ones I've heard =P Personally the realtime inphyy looks better than the cg one.

Let me make it clear what I mean not every game that has been shown will be some amazing cg and for what its worth I think Graw looks better than what was shown at E3 2005 (I'm talking about the part where they were walking and the building exploded not as they were walking down the abandoned local streets)

Blue Dragon matched its cg from E3 2005 in every way possible including animations according to IGN (admittedly there wasn't much cg shown of the game E3 2005 it'll be nearly impossible to match the latest cg shown this year, but who knows). Fight Night Round 3 for the 360 looks better than the realtime demo shown at E3 2005 =P Haha I know alot of bad examples and you said CGI, but there are a couple of actual games out there that do their trailers justice. Anyway here is the link

http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/707/707986p1.html

He did give us a ton of new details on his game and said it would have set his team back about a month to get together a demo or in-game trailer of Forza 2 for E3. Greenwalt doesn't care much about conventions though -- he's aiming for a holiday release.

Judging from that he clearly thinks the trailer didn't do the actual game justice.

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[b] Never judge a game too harshly via screenshots or videos, because they are in no way capable of properly representing what the game truly looks like were you to see it running in front of you on a 360 [/b]

2006-06-29 04:01:28 In reply to Optimusv2 (2006-06-29 02:59:50)

Wow Opti, I'm impressed at how you come to that conclusion. First of all, his name is Dan Greenawalt, not Greenwalt. -1 for IGN. Also, in no way, does he imply the game will look better than the trailer, IGN says he wants us to know the game "rocks way harder than that video clip"--what the hell does that mean?

Lastly, notice he's never quoted? My guess is that IGN dude was overeacting and totally taking comments out of context. Have you not seen the latest developer commentary in the "making of" video? I'd say he's happy with the trailer don't you think?

Again, no.

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2006-06-29 04:23:05

The making of trailer sounded more like they were thinking of things to say about what they had seen, rather than them showing what they had envisioned. So I really do think it was just MS PR telling them "we need you guys to comment on that trailer we made you guys" and them just going along with it.

Thats not really definitive of graphics really. Maybe he was saying it'd be more fast paced? More physics involved, or a better sense of speed. He didn't necessarily have to be speaking of the graphics.

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2006-06-29 04:55:07 In reply to Optimusv2 (2006-06-29 02:59:50)

that ign writer was full of shit. greenwalt said he wasn't angry about anything. plus, now we've got the behind the scenes trailer, where he talks at length about the passion vconveyed in the trailer. that whole piece is BS, and greenwalt didn't say a damn thing about the game looking better.

2006-06-29 05:29:52

I think everyone is overreacting just a tad.. and by not happy about it isn't to suggest he was angry with the trailer. Why in god's name would he be angry that someone else other than the forza team took the time to make a trailer for their game.

I think the man is trying to say our game has so much going on so many nice graphical tricks and cool little polishes and the trailer didn't manage to capture any of that.. I mean how could they? The forza team had absolutely nothing to do with the making of the trailer. I should make sure to clarify what I mean.. the trailer clearly didn't show off how their engine handles lighting.. how their engine handles textures.. how their engine handles the physics of the vehicles or crashes.. how their engine is handling the environments in general. Sure it showed off certain aspects, but as far as the game's graphics engine goes nobody here knows.


Its perfectly understandable that he'd feel the trailer didn't do the game justice what is he going to do in that behind the scenes insult the trailer for the game they are trying to promote? The trailer aside from the fact that forza 2 exists didn't show us much of anything from the game ;)

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[b] Never judge a game too harshly via screenshots or videos, because they are in no way capable of properly representing what the game truly looks like were you to see it running in front of you on a 360 [/b]

2006-06-29 06:06:02

optimus....wtf are you talking about?

YOU said greenwalt claimed the actual game looked better, and he clearly did not.

I don't know what those other ramblings you're going on are about, because no matter what the engine does with textures and lighting it will NEVER outpace that CGI. if you don't understand what texture artists and CG special effects renderers do with textures and lighting frame by individual frame to make a trailer like that, then I really can't help you.

please come back when you have a. some understanding of CG, and b. have actually read greenwalts own quotes on the subject.

2006-06-29 06:35:15

The name is GreenAwalt

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2006-06-29 06:42:45

rjcc wtf are YOU talking about? I'm clearly saying the trailer didn't capture all the the things they'll be doing with the game which Greenawalt pointed out INCLUDING graphics because that trailer isn't even using the games actual graphics engine.

Maybe I made a mistake by saying he said the game looks alot better, but its clear the man believes the trailer didn't manage to capture all the things they are doing with the game as the trailer wasn't using the game's graphics engine and it didn't capture the passion for cars they are known for. The game can look better than the trailer without even beating it graphically maybe they wanted to show off their much improved physics engine? Or the damage modeling? Or the actual engine and how they are doing the reflection mapping and how they are doing HDR? Its not out of the realm of possibility he can view the actually game as being a much better representative for what they are doing than a trailer they didn't even work on. You are saying the guy's own quotes clearly he was talking to the guy on ign?



Also all the trailer even showed off was impressive car models... the roads weren't amazingly detailed and I'm sure the actual game can beat the road we saw in that trailer and there are already games with better texture work on the dirt than we saw in that trailer. Fact is they just showed off some really nice blur effects a cool looking trailer opening up the engine for us to see zooming in on the front right wheel of the car when it hit the wall didn't bother to show us how they are even doing trees in the game properly. Ignored the crowd that was in the trailer, but completely out of focus and it appears they weren't even moving. In reality the only thing the trailer actually showed off was nice car models... at the end of the trailer as they hit finish line you could clearly see what looked like cardboard cutouts of fans not even moving an inch yet the cars were. Umm I think the actual game will be alot more busy than that trailer was.

I saw a nice light reflect off the hood of one of the cars at the beginning the rest in the trailer I see as easily possible in the actual game. That trailer was mostly nice editing and great choice of music at the right times. There isn't much in the trailer for the actual forza game to beat graphically besides the nice car models...


I need to actually find the link where the 2 guys involved in that behind the scenes actually said they weren't quite sure what to say since they didn't do something like that before and so they were actually asking people what they should even talk about in the behind the scenes.

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[b] Never judge a game too harshly via screenshots or videos, because they are in no way capable of properly representing what the game truly looks like were you to see it running in front of you on a 360 [/b]

2006-06-29 07:11:00

http://forzamotorsport.net/devcorner/pitpass/pitpa...

They were actually reading off of cue cards and from the sounds of it he didn't really care for it one way or the other as he says its just not his gig. Of course he probably didn't mean for it to sound like the way the ign guy said it, but obviously he said something to the effect that they believe the actual game is better than the trailer.

Doesn't necessarily need to beat the car models, they just need to come close and after seeing pgr3 I don't think that will be a problem for them especially since they've seemingly built a new engine and have had more time with the 360 than the pgr3 team has.

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[b] Never judge a game too harshly via screenshots or videos, because they are in no way capable of properly representing what the game truly looks like were you to see it running in front of you on a 360 [/b]

2006-06-29 07:12:49

ok, sure, use bold tags when you have nothing to say. if you think real time HDR is going to look better than completely mapped out prerendered lighting on the same model, then all I can do is laugh because you must be joking. I can't possibly take you seriously when you say something so ludicrous.

I asked you to use his quotes, all you have to do is go to forzamotorport.net and get them. what you're talking about is inaccurate paraphrasing and complete fabrications courtesy of IGN.

I'm a much bigger fan of this game than you are, however, I have common sense and am something resembling realistic about how computer graphics work. If you think the CG trailer "doesn't show off reflection mapping and HDR" then you don't know what those words mean.

2006-06-29 07:15:37 In reply to Optimusv2 (2006-06-29 07:11:00)

he didn't say anything to the effect that the game is going to look better than the trailer, period. if he had, it would have been quoted, in the many interviews you've posted, he has not said that.

doesn't need to beat the car models? as you already said, all the trailer really showed was the car models. we're not talking about the environment, because the trailer didn't show it.

2006-06-29 07:36:13

Where exactly did I say the trailer didn't show off reflection mapping or hdr? And you talk about inaccurate paraphrasing and complete fabrications... pretty hypocritical if you ask me.


I said how they are doing reflection mapping or HDR in the ACTUAL GAME ENGINE? *nobody knows* (Forza Motorsport 2 for the Xbox360 the game we'll play NOT a trailer) I'd like to see how stuff is implemented in the actual game engine the trailer shows us nothing other than to officially announce forza 2's existence. I'm sure if there are actual people in the game they'll be much better implemented in engine than we saw in the trailer ESPECIALLY one they didn't even make. Its funny you noticed I was completely writing off the reflection mapping and HDR shown in that trailer because its nonsense I don't care about it because it means nothing to me show me the reflection mapping and HDR using the ingame engine... then we have something to talk about.


http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/707/707986p1.html

So apparently IGN is lying about everything they said they spoke to the guy about?

To me actual in engine stuff is better than cg rubbish anyday of the week. You can continue defending the superiority of the cg all you want, but the fact is I don't care that cg didn't show me anything about the game other than its existence, but you can continue defending it if you'd like. All I saw was fancy video editing and nice car models everything else doesn't matter worth a damn because it isn't representative of the actual game. The trailer didn't need to tell me there would be customization.. (everyone knows that) and I don't care how big a fan you claim you are I've been waiting for this game for awhile and I don't have too much longer to wait thankfully.

I already admitted maybe I made a mistake by flat out saying it looks better than the trailer without being specific enough. I'm saying the trailer sure as hell didn't capture what forza 2 will be all about. The guy skid out of control in the trailer and hit the wall thats all well and good now show me how that looks in the actual game :)

I like all types of games, but this racing game specifically is the racing game I want the most on a next gen console.. will you win some award for claiming you are a bigger fan than I am? I don't think so. Anyway I'm done arguing with ya now as there is no point really :)

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[b] Never judge a game too harshly via screenshots or videos, because they are in no way capable of properly representing what the game truly looks like were you to see it running in front of you on a 360 [/b]

2006-06-29 07:49:15

"The game can look better than the trailer without even beating it graphically maybe they wanted to show off their much improved physics engine? Or the damage modeling? Or the actual engine and how they are doing the reflection mapping and how they are doing HDR?"

If dan greenawalt says the trailer was about capturing the feeling of the game, and you say it doesn't capture what the game is all about, I'm going to believe him more than you.

you have no clue what you're talking about and are saying anything you can to put positive spin where none is necessary.

no shit the trailer isn't representative of the final game, I never said it was, in fact, I was specifically arguing that it wasn't . You're the one who is obsessed with comparing it to your fantastical ideas of what the game might look like. if you think its not representative of the final game, why are you going on and on about how the game is going to look better? you know what don't answer that because it's going to be more blather and more links back to the same inaccurate article.

and now you call me a hypocrite? I'm just someone with an ounce of common sense, not someone just trying to find whatever buzzword I can to prove how much I like the 360.