Team Fortress 2 Hands On from Gamespot.com

Since 7498 Days

http://previews.teamxbox.com/xbox-360/1659/HalfLif...

My recent visit to Valve’s offices in Bellevue only reinforced that belief, as I had the chance to play a number of intense matches before the controller was forcibly pried out of my hands. After playing I can say that Team Fortress 2 is, without a doubt, my early favorite for the multiplayer game of 2007....

Simply put, the visuals in Team Fortress 2 are amazing. If you aren’t sold on the cartoonish qualities now, just wait until you play it for the first time. As was their goal, the designers have succeeded in making the characters look completely unique...

Team Fortress 2 is shaping up to be the deepest multiplayer game of the year, as well as the most imaginative. The visuals may be the first thing that grabs you, but it’ll only take a game or two to get you hooked.

With this Orange Pack from Valve, they have a great value and a most own for a lot of Xbox 360 owners. I imagine this game will be huge, and will sell big on 360, as compared to when Half-life 2 came out on the original Xbox.

In reply to

http://previews.teamxbox.com/xbox-360/1659/HalfLife-2-The-Orange-Box/p1/

My recent visit to Valve’s offices in Bellevue only reinforced that belief, as I had the chance to play a number of intense matches before the controller was forcibly pried out of my hands. After playing I can say that Team Fortress 2 is, without a doubt, my early favorite for the multiplayer game of 2007....

Simply put, the visuals in Team Fortress 2 are amazing. If you aren’t sold on the cartoonish qualities now, just wait until you play it for the first time. As was their goal, the designers have succeeded in making the characters look completely unique...

Team Fortress 2 is shaping up to be the deepest multiplayer game of the year, as well as the most imaginative. The visuals may be the first thing that grabs you, but it’ll only take a game or two to get you hooked.

With this Orange Pack from Valve, they have a great value and a most own for a lot of Xbox 360 owners.  I imagine this game will be huge, and will sell big on 360, as compared to when Half-life 2 came out on the original Xbox.

Acert93

Since 6772 Days

This is my #1 game of 2007. I am hoping for 360-PC connectivity so I can play my 360 friends from my PC. And when I wear out my mouse in early 2008 I can get properly initiated with my 65nm 360 and have a sea of titles to pick up on the cheap :P

/me phones Grift, "How does the TF2 demo play on your 6800GT?"

In reply to

The fans have spoken. Concerning the graphics of the Halo 3 Beta: "There's so many little effects and things going on that make this game pretty much 2nd only to Gears at the moment."

Acert93

Since 6772 Days

Btw, that is a TeamXbox link!

Of special note is the Taunt button, which allows you to mock your opponent at anytime. The camera will switch from a first-person view that allows you to see your character full-on, at which point he will launch into a brief and hilarious animation designed to allow you to rub your foes’ incompetence in their face. The characters have a unique one for each of their three weapons, and all of the ones we saw made us laugh out loud. Seeing the hulking Heavy Weapons Guy kiss and caress Sasha (his uber-powerful minigun) after blowing away an enemy was one of the highlights of my visit.

Excellent! Wrestling meets FPS :P

The Heavy Weapons Guy may have that big chaingun, but it takes a while to get it rolling (though you can charge it up at the expense of your foot speed) and isn’t very accurate from afar. The Scout, on the other hand, is devastatingly quick, but lacks the firepower of the more offense-minded characters. Walker explained that a showdown between a Pyro (who wields a flamethrower) and a Scout will play out different depending on the locale. In an open area, the Scout can run circles around the Pyro and dart in and out of the flamethrower’s range, but he’ll quickly be barbecued if they run into each other in a tight room. The outcomes of the game’s myriad showdowns are dependent on a wide range of variables, and should make the game one of the most balanced multiplayer titles ever.

What they are describing is a concept I have long held to and wished would evolve in FPS: The "fighter" mechanic. Fighters are full of diversity where each character has a style that is tied to strengths and weaknesses. FPS have tended along more linear lines with only minor deviations--maybe some run speed, a special skill here or there (class), and weapon load out. But completely embracing the concept and creating variant objective gameplays that can cater to different class strengths and designing levels with certain "trait choke points" -- be it open areas where one class excels and closed areas where others excel -- and now you have *thoughtfully* implimented a huge base of diverse gameplay. This is huge, especially for me. I have friends with a lot of different skills and tastes. Having various classes that can match their style and skills and allow them to contribute and learn the nuances of such to really do well is important.

And it sounds like Valve has some nice touches going in. Hearing that snipers become more powerful the longer they are zoomed in is a nice move. Sniping is hard to balance -- you either have twitch Quake sniping or some sort of movement deviation. Both have pros and cons. Now we get a nice third: The longer you are zoomed in the more powerful you are. This will result in snipers being zoomed in more often and stationary -- which also leaves them open to counter sniping and ambushing, requiring their teammates communicate with them and even protect them.

The visuals may be the first thing that grabs you, but it’ll only take a game or two to get you hooked. The classes are varied, unique and (perhaps most importantly) perfectly balanced, ensuring a long shelf life. This is one game that we know we’ll still be playing for many, many months (if not years) to come.

Loved the first, played for years, and totally set to renew my addiction. Bring it on!

Sad to see self shadows seem to have died :( Still looks awesome, notably due to the impressive art design and quality, but I was really digging the little touch, almost CGI cartoon like.

Anyone who played Half-Life 2 running on a high-end PC knows that the game will look great (especially when compared to the original Xbox version), but the developers told me that they’ve added a number of new effects in Episode Two, including a bunch of new shaders, HDR rendering (this was also appear in the Xbox 360 version of Half-Life 2 for the first time), a revamped particle system, and a full screen motion blur. I also learned that they’ll be leveraging the power of the Xbox 360 as much as possible, which includes using the multiple cores to improve the loading times.

HDR to HL2 is a nice addition. I know they added dynamic soft shadows; I am quite curious to see all their changes.

“We’re looking at a number of ways [to get the game to Xbox 360 owners]. Through retail, there will probably be some sort of collection that mirrors the idea of The Orange Box, in that it’ll introduce some new content and also include extra stuff to help catch people up if they’re only joining at that point. We’re also talking to Microsoft about the idea of Episode Three being made available, by itself, via Xbox Live.”

Now that would be pretty cool. But I see it now: HL2 Red Box: HL2/E1/2/3, TF2, Portal, Portal 2... and CounterStrike 2. 2009 anyone? And just in time for a new franchise in there sometime and for 2011ish we could see a proper HL3... err HL4 where portal guns and destrictible worlds come into full play. I will probably be playing TF2 by then too!

In reply to

Btw, that is a TeamXbox link!

[quote]Of special note is the Taunt button, which allows you to mock your opponent at anytime. The camera will switch from a first-person view that allows you to see your character full-on, at which point he will launch into a brief and hilarious animation designed to allow you to rub your foes’ incompetence in their face. The characters have a unique one for each of their three weapons, and all of the ones we saw made us laugh out loud. Seeing the hulking Heavy Weapons Guy kiss and caress Sasha (his uber-powerful minigun) after blowing away an enemy was one of the highlights of my visit. [/quote]

Excellent! Wrestling meets FPS :P

[quote]The Heavy Weapons Guy may have that big chaingun, but it takes a while to get it rolling (though you can charge it up at the expense of your foot speed) and isn’t very accurate from afar. The Scout, on the other hand, is devastatingly quick, but lacks the firepower of the more offense-minded characters. Walker explained that a showdown between a Pyro (who wields a flamethrower) and a Scout will play out different depending on the locale. In an open area, the Scout can run circles around the Pyro and dart in and out of the flamethrower’s range, but he’ll quickly be barbecued if they run into each other in a tight room. The outcomes of the game’s myriad showdowns are dependent on a wide range of variables, and should make the game one of the most balanced multiplayer titles ever. [/quote]

What they are describing is a concept I have long held to and wished would evolve in FPS: The "fighter" mechanic. Fighters are full of diversity where each character has a style that is tied to strengths and weaknesses. FPS have tended along more linear lines with only minor deviations--maybe some run speed, a special skill here or there (class), and weapon load out. But completely embracing the concept and creating variant objective gameplays that can cater to different class strengths and designing levels with certain "trait choke points" -- be it open areas where one class excels and closed areas where others excel -- and now you have *thoughtfully* implimented a huge base of diverse gameplay. This is huge, especially for me. I have friends with a lot of different skills and tastes. Having various classes that can match their style and skills and allow them to contribute and learn the nuances of such to really do well is important.

And it sounds like Valve has some nice touches going in. Hearing that snipers become more powerful the longer they are zoomed in is a nice move. Sniping is hard to balance -- you either have twitch Quake sniping or some sort of movement deviation. Both have pros and cons. Now we get a nice third: The longer you are zoomed in the more powerful you are. This will result in snipers being zoomed in more often and stationary -- which also leaves them open to counter sniping and ambushing, requiring their teammates communicate with them and even protect them.

[quote]The visuals may be the first thing that grabs you, but it’ll only take a game or two to get you hooked. The classes are varied, unique and (perhaps most importantly) perfectly balanced, ensuring a long shelf life. This is one game that we know we’ll still be playing for many, many months (if not years) to come. [/quote]

Loved the first, played for years, and totally set to renew my addiction. Bring it on!

Sad to see self shadows seem to have died :( Still looks awesome, notably due to the impressive art design and quality, but I was really digging the little touch, almost CGI cartoon like.

[quote]Anyone who played Half-Life 2 running on a high-end PC knows that the game will look great (especially when compared to the original Xbox version), but the developers told me that they’ve added a number of new effects in Episode Two, including a bunch of new shaders, HDR rendering (this was also appear in the Xbox 360 version of Half-Life 2 for the first time), a revamped particle system, and a full screen motion blur. I also learned that they’ll be leveraging the power of the Xbox 360 as much as possible, which includes using the multiple cores to improve the loading times. [/quote]

HDR to HL2 is a nice addition. I know they added dynamic soft shadows; I am quite curious to see all their changes.

[quote]“We’re looking at a number of ways [to get the game to Xbox 360 owners]. Through retail, there will probably be some sort of collection that mirrors the idea of The Orange Box, in that it’ll introduce some new content and also include extra stuff to help catch people up if they’re only joining at that point. We’re also talking to Microsoft about the idea of Episode Three being made available, by itself, via Xbox Live.” [/quote]

Now that would be pretty cool. But I see it now: HL2 Red Box: HL2/E1/2/3, TF2, Portal, Portal 2... and CounterStrike 2. 2009 anyone? And just in time for a new franchise in there sometime and for 2011ish we could see a proper HL3... err HL4 where portal guns and destrictible worlds come into full play. I will probably be playing TF2 by then too!

The fans have spoken. Concerning the graphics of the Halo 3 Beta: "There's so many little effects and things going on that make this game pretty much 2nd only to Gears at the moment."

anm8rjp

Since 7498 Days

Yeah my bad on the teamxbox/gamespot mixup.

You can expect good things from this gamepack... I doubt valve will let us down...
Acert bad news.... I heard PC/Xbox360 interplay is not going to be in the retail version... if I see the article again, I'll link it here. They are playing it in house that way, but it won't make it into the final game.

In reply to

Acert93

Since 6772 Days

I wonder what factors are impacting that? It obviously works, they have mentioned it... is it the KB/MS factor? Is it the issue of Live-Steam connectivity when MS is trying to push Windows Live?

A simple filter to the former to exclude all PC players resolves that issue. The second issue will only change when... never!

In reply to

The fans have spoken. Concerning the graphics of the Halo 3 Beta: "There's so many little effects and things going on that make this game pretty much 2nd only to Gears at the moment."

Jin187

Since 6545 Days

I think its more to do with the fact that its originally designed for PC therefore a keyboard/mouse combo would own a controller giving the PC user an unfair advantage.

In reply to

Inflatable

Since 7439 Days

Yup, the only way to balance things is seriously f*ck with the aimingsystem and slow down the game, and that would never be accepted by the oldskool PC crowd.. They can get away with that stuff in games like Shadowrun because that's a new IP, but not a series like Half-Life which has a lot of oldskool fans on the PC..

Also the fact that for crossplatform gaming you need Live which only works under Vista might have something to do with it..

Together with CoD4, UT3, ET:QW and maybe Crysis, TF2 is probably the biggest online MP game of 2007 (on the PC).. I'm very much looking forward of playing most of those games (UT3 and TF2 are mustbuys for me, not yet 100% sure about the others).. PC FPS online MP gaming is making a big splash end of this year for sure..

In reply to

http://www.cyberwarriors.nl
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Acert93

Since 6772 Days

Posted by Jin187

I think its more to do with the fact that its originally designed for PC therefore a keyboard/mouse combo would own a controller giving the PC user an unfair advantage.

The TeamXbox preview notes they were playing the PC version with the Xbox 360 gamepad.

So I don't buy it was not "designed" arguement. Sure, I agree the KB/MS is superior, but that is due to the nature of the device and not the design of the game. Only when you begin heavily biasing auto aim, magnatism, etc does there become more parity, and that isn't a design issue as much as it is a hardware strength/weakness issue.

As a 360 game, though, they better make the game work with the gamepad! And if it works, I see no reason why not to allow connectivity outside of

a. Console gamers whining about PC gamers owning them
b. MS insisting on cross play using Xbox Live on both ends
c. The headache of updates and cross compatibility and dual updates, both for PC and for the Console, and issues of identifying and synchronizing content as well as hacks.

A is resolved with a filter, B is a $ issue that MS probably doesn't want to engage seeing as it could kill Live on the PC, and C is more of an issue of not neutering the extensibility and flexibility of the PC community.

All these have work arounds, even simple ones. B needs MS to allow developers the freedom to provide great content to users and stop worrying about protecting every inch of their platform for themselves. As a console maker they goal is to make consumers and developers happy as much as fill your coffers (the former produces the latter). And the last one is easily resolved with only allowing certified content through crossplay, meaning console gamers get only the core, retail experience.

But I think this really comes down to Live and the fact a KB/MS is going to excell in a native FPS.

In reply to

[quote=Jin187]I think its more to do with the fact that its originally designed for PC therefore a keyboard/mouse combo would own a controller giving the PC user an unfair advantage.[/quote]

The TeamXbox preview notes they were playing the PC version with the Xbox 360 gamepad.

So I don't buy it was not "designed" arguement. Sure, I agree the KB/MS is superior, but that is due to the nature of the device and not the design of the game. Only when you begin heavily biasing auto aim, magnatism, etc does there become more parity, and that isn't a design issue as much as it is a hardware strength/weakness issue.

As a 360 game, though, they better make the game work with the gamepad! And if it works, I see no reason why not to allow connectivity outside of

a. Console gamers whining about PC gamers owning them
b. MS insisting on cross play using Xbox Live on both ends
c. The headache of updates and cross compatibility and dual updates, both for PC and for the Console, and issues of identifying and synchronizing content as well as hacks.

A is resolved with a filter, B is a $ issue that MS probably doesn't want to engage seeing as it could kill Live on the PC, and C is more of an issue of not neutering the extensibility and flexibility of the PC community.

All these have work arounds, even simple ones. B needs MS to allow developers the freedom to provide great content to users and stop worrying about protecting every inch of their platform for themselves. As a console maker they goal is to make consumers and developers happy as much as fill your coffers (the former produces the latter). And the last one is easily resolved with only allowing certified content through crossplay, meaning console gamers get only the core, retail experience.

But I think this really comes down to Live and the fact a KB/MS is going to excell in a native FPS.

The fans have spoken. Concerning the graphics of the Halo 3 Beta: "There's so many little effects and things going on that make this game pretty much 2nd only to Gears at the moment."

Ronsauce

Since 6786 Days

Posted by Acert93

And it sounds like Valve has some nice touches going in. Hearing that snipers become more powerful the longer they are zoomed in is a nice move. Sniping is hard to balance -- you either have twitch Quake sniping or some sort of movement deviation. Both have pros and cons. Now we get a nice third: The longer you are zoomed in the more powerful you are.

This isn't new by any means. I'm not srue about the first Team Fortress, but Team Fortress Classic had the same feature.

In reply to

GriftGFX

Since 6801 Days

Posted by Acert93

This is my #1 game of 2007. I am hoping for 360-PC connectivity so I can play my 360 friends from my PC. And when I wear out my mouse in early 2008 I can get properly initiated with my 65nm 360 and have a sea of titles to pick up on the cheap :P

/me phones Grift, "How does the TF2 demo play on your 6800GT?"

Man.. I wish I had a TF2 demo to test out on my 6800GT. I'm really worried about my board now though. The overheating thing is approaching ridiculous levels. I've literally never heard of a working 6800GT performing so poorly when it came to cooling. It wasn't always like this, but the card looks fine. No visible damage to any of the caps, and the cooler is perfectly clean.. I fear there is a deeper problem here.. and there's not much I can do about it now. The card is far out of warranty at this point.

I'm sorta doubting that any of valve's games will support cross platform play though. I think MS is pretty much insisting that Live Anywhere is the only way to support such a feature, and I don't think Valve is going to jump on board that platform any time soon. Could be wrong, but I think the big PC developers are going to avoid Live Anywhere for some time now..

So I don't buy it was not "designed" arguement. Sure, I agree the KB/MS is superior, but that is due to the nature of the device and not the design of the game. Only when you begin heavily biasing auto aim, magnatism, etc does there become more parity, and that isn't a design issue as much as it is a hardware strength/weakness issue.

But some games are designed with loads of auto aim and camera adhesion in mind.. so it comes back to being a design issue again. I'm with Inflatable (unsurprisingly) on tihs one.. there really is no comparison until you implement those features -- and once you do you are alienating the PC audience.

In reply to

[quote=Acert93]This is my #1 game of 2007. I am hoping for 360-PC connectivity so I can play my 360 friends from my PC. And when I wear out my mouse in early 2008 I can get properly initiated with my 65nm 360 and have a sea of titles to pick up on the cheap :P

/me phones Grift, "How does the TF2 demo play on your 6800GT?"[/quote]

Man.. I wish I had a TF2 demo to test out on my 6800GT.  I'm really worried about my board now though.  The overheating thing is approaching ridiculous levels.  I've literally never heard of a working 6800GT performing so poorly when it came to cooling.  It wasn't always like this, but the card [i]looks[/i] fine.  No visible damage to any of the caps, and the cooler is perfectly clean.. I fear there is a deeper problem here.. and there's not much I can do about it now.  The card is far out of warranty at this point.

I'm sorta doubting that any of valve's games will support cross platform play though.  I think MS is pretty much insisting that Live Anywhere is the only way to support such a feature, and I don't think Valve is going to jump on board that platform any time soon.  Could be wrong, but I think the big PC developers are going to avoid Live Anywhere for  some time now..

[quote]So I don't buy it was not "designed" arguement. Sure, I agree the KB/MS is superior, but that is due to the nature of the device and not the design of the game. Only when you begin heavily biasing auto aim, magnatism, etc does there become more parity, and that isn't a design issue as much as it is a hardware strength/weakness issue.[/quote]

But some games are designed with loads of auto aim and camera adhesion in mind.. so it comes back to being a design issue again.  I'm with Inflatable (unsurprisingly) on tihs one.. there really is no comparison until you implement those features -- and once you do you are alienating the PC audience.

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