Battlefield 3 -- Now with *less* suppression! - Main forum

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A few more sparse details:

The franchise that revolutionized online multiplayer for PC games is back.

In our world-exclusive cover story, Game Informer unveils the first numbered entry in the Battlefield series since 2005. Many longtime fans are wondering, "what took so long?!" DICE has honed the concept for the true sequel for years, but it wasn't until the company developed the powerful new Frostbite 2 engine that it felt all the pieces were in place to create a proper follow-up. Armed with powerful upgrades like deferred rendering, real-time radiosity, a new animation system borrowed from the EA Sports label, and an exponential leap in destructibility, executive producer Patrick Bach dubs Frostbite 2 "the best piece of technology on the market when it comes to building games."

You'll have to read the magazine to get the dirt on what DICE has in store for the single-player and multiplayer modes, but check back here and visit the official Battlefield 3 site tomorrow to watch the premiere teaser trailer and glean a few more key details.

Frequent the Battlefield 3 hub throughout the month of February for more exclusive features about the highly anticipated shooter coming to the PlayStation 3, Xbox 360, PC.

Realtime radiosity? An exponential leap in destructibility? Yeah.. I need to upgrade.

En réponse à

A few more sparse details:

[quote]The franchise that revolutionized online multiplayer for PC games is back.

In our world-exclusive cover story, Game Informer unveils the first numbered entry in the Battlefield series since 2005. Many longtime fans are wondering, "what took so long?!" DICE has honed the concept for the true sequel for years, but it wasn't until the company developed the powerful new Frostbite 2 engine that it felt all the pieces were in place to create a proper follow-up. Armed with powerful upgrades like deferred rendering, real-time radiosity, a new animation system borrowed from the EA Sports label, and an exponential leap in destructibility, executive producer Patrick Bach dubs Frostbite 2 "the best piece of technology on the market when it comes to building games."

You'll have to read the magazine to get the dirt on what DICE has in store for the single-player and multiplayer modes, but check back here and visit the official Battlefield 3 site tomorrow to watch the premiere teaser trailer and glean a few more key details.

Frequent the Battlefield 3 hub throughout the month of February for more exclusive features about the highly anticipated shooter coming to the PlayStation 3, Xbox 360, PC.[/quote]

Realtime radiosity? An exponential leap in destructibility? Yeah.. I need to upgrade.

GriftGFX

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LJN7G0gA8g

Demonstrating the real time radiosity in Frostbite 2.0. Radiosity is a big leap forward for real time lighting. This could be really, really impressive.

I wonder if the console versions will do radiosity as well.

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blmbox

Inscrit depuis 6155 Jours

Posté par GriftGFX

I wonder if the console versions will do radiosity as well.

Apparently CE3 does, which would suggest that it's achievable.

One of the most promising aspects from those details are the animations. Recent DICE animations in the BF:BC games have been... well, less than satisfactory for me. The fact that they're borrowing from EA Sports - where animation is just about their strongest point - makes me very optimistic about that part of the game.

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GriftGFX

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

What's CE3?

And no, really, radiosity could be a really big deal.

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blmbox

Inscrit depuis 6155 Jours

CryEngine3... although I think that might only be for the PC. I don't know if it actually does - it's just what I've heard.

Radiosity is totally a big deal.

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Frozpot

Inscrit depuis 6583 Jours

Devs have been faking radiosity for a few years. It really shows the difference in dynamic situations, and I hope Dice capitalizes on this. The destruction should display this quite a bit, actually, with all shifting geometry...

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Oooh, Profound, isn't it?

GriftGFX

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

* Prone will be on all 3 platforms, not just PC
* Dolphin Driving/Dropshooting will not work.
* Spotting (in an undecided form) will be making a return
* While the PC version will have up to 64 player online matches, the number is limited to 24 on consoles
* There will be a friendly fire option, turned off by default
* Knives and dogtags will return
* There will be no ziplines or grapple hooks
* There will be bullet drop, but “Doesn’t work the same as BC2 though, it’s a much deeper system.“
* No tracer darts

"Dropshot" crybabies win.

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FireWire

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

Good, I don't mind people diving for cover, but diving and than shooting me while still mid-air is bullshit..

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"First come smiles, then comes lies. Last is gunfire"

GriftGFX

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

Posté par FireWire

Good, I don't mind people diving for cover, but diving and than shooting me while still mid-air is bullshit..

Learn2play.

People prone to crunch hitboxes--big f'n deal--you can do it too. People complain (wrongfully) that prone is "just for camping" as a justification for its absence from BC2, and now there will be some horrific delay where you can't actually take advantage of prone in an actual firefight. Might as well just come with a tent and a campfire.

I know that's running to negative assumptions. Hopefully movement will at least feel fluid with all of the ridiculous restrictions people have forced them to make.

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FireWire

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

Posté par GriftGFX

Learn2play.

Ahh right that must be it....

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"First come smiles, then comes lies. Last is gunfire"

GriftGFX

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

Hey, that was the knee-jerk reaction to every complaint about Call of Duty, so it's only fair ;)

The stance delays in BF2 were terrible, and only even existed in the first place because its what the masses wanted. The masses don't usually know what the hell they're talking about. A lot of the reason that BF2 changed so much in every little patch was because people wanted it to be more "fair." Fair in this case just means smoothing over the skill curve, and making the game less enjoyable at higher levels of play.

It shouldn't bother me as much in BF3 so long as these systems are actually designed into the gameplay and no shoved down our throats post-release.

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Frozpot

Inscrit depuis 6583 Jours

Posté par GriftGFX

"Dropshot" crybabies win.

*does victory dance*... Sorry ;)
It's the "proning" that doesn't fit. It may have been in past games, but it still doesn't fit with the feel or spirit I get from the franchise. I have zero problem with the "camping" aspect of prone, as that is a legitimate and real function of the firing stance... I am sorry that you don't like the removal though, Grift...

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Oooh, Profound, isn't it?

GriftGFX

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

Posté par Frozpot

but it still doesn't fit with the feel or spirit I get from the franchise.

Sorry.. what a load. But to each their own. Hopefully the training wheels come off at some point.

I'm not too worried. At least it will be dealt with up front this time.. and hopefully not completely terrible, as the stance delays in BF2 and even 2142 are. The latter actually concerns me more, since it dealt with the issue immediately and with equally poor results.

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Frozpot

Inscrit depuis 6583 Jours

Posté par GriftGFX

Sorry.. what a load.

I don't see how. Battlefield always walked the line on realism, and the "drop shot" is way on a different side of play-style. If you have the room, it's not a bad tactic as it's harder to hit stuff further away, but 5 feet away from someone.. come on. Maybe if there was a steep accuracy penalty as you drop, so then you might get lucky with it. Diving to cover, even dropping to avoid being shot, then rolling to cover, is legit, imo. I still want to see more modification in stances (like the use of low-cover to stabilize). You could also use the Learn2play comment on the removal of a lame tactic that I bet Dice hadn't expected to be used in the first place...

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Oooh, Profound, isn't it?

FireWire

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

Posté par GriftGFX

People prone to crunch hitboxes--big f'n deal--you can do it too. People complain (wrongfully) that prone is "just for camping" as a justification for its absence from BC2, and now there will be some horrific delay where you can't actually take advantage of prone in an actual firefight. Might as well just come with a tent and a campfire.

I have no problem actually going prone or being prone during a firefight, what I have problem with is;
When I'm shooting at someone and he goes prone (to get into cover or to minimize their hitbox) there should be some sort of accuracy penalty while doing it. Especially when someone runs and jumps/dives into prone. I don't mind it being in the game, but I think it's bullshit that your accuracy stays the same while flying through the air.
I mean your accuracy should be increased again after hitting the ground...

It's the same with running versus standing still. I should be more accurate while standing still then when I'm on the move...

En réponse à

[quote=GriftGFX]

People prone to crunch hitboxes--big f'n deal--you can do it too. People complain (wrongfully) that prone is "just for camping" as a justification for its absence from BC2, and now there will be some horrific delay where you can't actually take advantage of prone in an actual firefight. Might as well just come with a tent and a campfire.[/quote]

I have no problem actually going prone or being prone during a firefight, what I have problem with is; 
When I'm shooting at someone and he goes prone (to get into cover or to minimize their hitbox) there should be some sort of accuracy penalty while doing it. Especially when someone runs and jumps/dives into prone. I don't mind it being in the game, but I think it's bullshit that your accuracy stays the same while flying through the air. 
I mean your accuracy should be increased again after hitting the ground...

It's the same with running versus standing still. I should be more accurate while standing still then when I'm on the move...

"First come smiles, then comes lies. Last is gunfire"

Frozpot

Inscrit depuis 6583 Jours

Woah... like... ESP and shit...

En réponse à

Oooh, Profound, isn't it?

GriftGFX

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

"Walked the line on realism" is a bit of a stretch. Battlefield has never been close to simulation. That's why games like ArmA exist. They're there if that's what you're really looking for. And yes, you could throw the "learn2play" comment around in either direction. It was supposed to be a little tongue in cheek. The fact remains that stance delays only served to soften the skill curve in BF2, and that's exactly what they'll do here too. The difference: I'll do fine without it. A lot (the vast majority) of the people who begged for these changes in the first place did it because they were getting schooled.

Posté par FireWire

I have no problem actually going prone or being prone during a firefight, what I have problem with is;
When I'm shooting at someone and he goes prone (to get into cover or to minimize their hitbox) there should be some sort of accuracy penalty while doing it. Especially when someone runs and jumps/dives into prone. I don't mind it being in the game, but I think it's bullshit that your accuracy stays the same while flying through the air.
I mean your accuracy should be increased again after hitting the ground...

It's the same with running versus standing still. I should be more accurate while standing still then when I'm on the move...

What you guys seem to want will make movement so punishing that it will be suicide to even bother. You can't fire in the air in BF2 anymore (which already had a fucking huge accuracy penalty); There's a fire delay during the change stance animation (which is painfully.. painful); and there's a fucking delay before you can change stance again. Ugh it's so bad.

Hopefully this "feels" right, because it's pretty fucking terrible in BF2.

En réponse à

"Walked the line on realism" is a bit of a stretch. Battlefield has never been close to simulation. That's why games like ArmA exist. They're there if that's what you're really looking for. And yes, you could throw the "learn2play" comment around in either direction. It was supposed to be a little tongue in cheek. The [b]fact[/b] remains that stance delays only served to soften the skill curve in BF2, and that's exactly what they'll do here too. The difference: I'll do fine without it. A lot (the vast majority) of the people who [i]begged[/i] for these changes in the first place did it because they were getting schooled.

[quote=FireWire]I have no problem actually going prone or being prone during a firefight, what I have problem with is; 
When I'm shooting at someone and he goes prone (to get into cover or to minimize their hitbox) there should be some sort of accuracy penalty while doing it. Especially when someone runs and jumps/dives into prone. I don't mind it being in the game, but I think it's bullshit that your accuracy stays the same while flying through the air. 
I mean your accuracy should be increased again after hitting the ground...

It's the same with running versus standing still. I should be more accurate while standing still then when I'm on the move...[/quote]

What you guys seem to want will make movement so punishing that it will be [i]suicide[/i] to even bother. You can't fire in the air in BF2 anymore (which already had a [i]fucking huge[/i] accuracy penalty); There's a fire delay during the change stance animation (which is painfully.. painful); and there's a fucking delay before you can change stance again. Ugh it's [i]so bad[/i].

Hopefully this "feels" right, because it's pretty fucking terrible in BF2.

Frozpot

Inscrit depuis 6583 Jours

Eh, I see it more like PGR, a solid mix, but the suspension of disbelief is the main objective while keeping it a game, and thus fun. I know exactly what the "real thing" feels like, I lived it, and the Battlefield captures the feel (ie. the weight of your body, the movement speed, aiming down the sights, firing the weapons) better than anything else I've played. That drives home the point for me more than anything, and I'd like to see more movement options done the way they do it. It has nothing to do with "fair" for me. I do agree that some stance changes shouldn't have big delays unless you do it while running. Keep in mind, I've not played BF2. You've made me want to at least try when my PC comes in though...

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Oooh, Profound, isn't it?

GriftGFX

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

Posté par Frozpot

I've not played BF2.

Explains a bit about what you seem to think Battlefield is about. That's not a dig, but I don't really consider Bad Company a "real" Battlefield game. It's still a good game, a plenty flawed game, but a good game. Rush is terrible, and the conquest maps are mostly average at best (and extremely dumbed down.. global uncaps on every map ffs), but those aren't even the biggies. The fact that everything is streamlined to support lone wolf play is. Total meh.

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FireWire

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

Posté par GriftGFX

What you guys seem to want will make movement so punishing that it will be suicide to even bother. You can't fire in the air in BF2 anymore (which already had a fucking huge accuracy penalty); There's a fire delay during the change stance animation (which is painfully.. painful); and there's a fucking delay before you can change stance again. Ugh it's so bad.

Hopefully this "feels" right, because it's pretty fucking terrible in BF2.

So you wouldn't want any kind of penalty to be in place then?

I just mentioned an accuracy penalty, I find a fire delay and a "change stance" delay horrible to be honest.
I just feel that a hit on your accuracy while diving for the ground is necessary.

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"First come smiles, then comes lies. Last is gunfire"

GriftGFX

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

Posté par FireWire

So you wouldn't want any kind of penalty to be in place then?

I just mentioned an accuracy penalty, I find a fire delay and a "change stance" delay horrible to be honest.
I just feel that a hit on your accuracy while diving for the ground is necessary.

If BF2 and 2142 are any indication on how they will approach this issue, then yes, I'd much rather go back to what it was like prior to Battlefield 2's first big patch.

Hell, I was ranting about how much I wanted prone in BC2, but if they drop the ball here, I'd rather go without it all together. It's going to marginalize movement anyway.

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FireWire

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

Pffffff , okay I'll try to word it differently then;

If by some accident they manage to incorporate an accuracy penalty without limiting your movement, would you look positive towards such an penalty?

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"First come smiles, then comes lies. Last is gunfire"

Frozpot

Inscrit depuis 6583 Jours

Posté par GriftGFX

Explains a bit about what you seem to think Battlefield is about.

I did play it momentarily at an MWR in Iraq while off-mission back in '06. I don't remember it having the same physicality as Bad Company. I didn't pay much attention to it though as I wasn't really into MP gaming at the time...

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Oooh, Profound, isn't it?

GriftGFX

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

Posté par FireWire

If by some accident they manage to incorporate an accuracy penalty without limiting your movement, would you look positive towards such an penalty?

I don't know, to be honest. I'd have to try it.

I don't think prone is game breaking in Call of Duty either, and I'm glad that they haven't caved to the exact same complaints. Movement is one of the few things Call of Duty still does exceedingly well.

Posté par Frozpot

I don't remember it having the same physicality as Bad Company.

Edited that post to explain myself better--but in reply to this one: It didn't, but it was still 10x the game.

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FireWire

Inscrit depuis 6824 Jours

Posté par GriftGFX

I don't think prone is game breaking in Call of Duty either, and I'm glad that they haven't caved to the exact same complaints. Movement is one of the few things Call of Duty still does exceedingly well.

Like I said; the ability to go PRONE is not the issue.. But GOING PRONE without a penalty while doing so is...

En réponse à

"First come smiles, then comes lies. Last is gunfire"

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