The XbOne Yard

Since 7426 Days

That's not what Digital Sharing used to be, but okay. It's just saying that everything you put onto your Xbox One (Games, Gold) can be used by anyone who signs into it. Not monumental but it's a fair step towards digital.

I thought they'd mentioned before that you could use an Xbox 360 and One with the same Gold simultaneously.

In reply to

GrimThorne

Since 7453 Days

Of course it isn't what it used to be, too much of the original plan was attached to the "installations only" discs, so it's impossible to support both models.

But as I already said, day one digital is going to do to physical media what it did to the Video and Record store chains. There won't be much to trade and swap on the shelves soon.

In reply to

Phaethon360

Since 7426 Days

In reply to

GrimThorne

Since 7453 Days

Hey, enjoy your physical media as long as you can.

In reply to

KORNdog

Since 6985 Days

What do you actually get access to if you DON'T pay for gold membership? Genuine question..

In reply to

GriftGFX

Since 7581 Days

Posted by KORNdog

What do you actually get access to if you DON'T pay for gold membership? Genuine question..

Constantly reminded that you don't have access to all of the content and features for your games.

In reply to

BLackHawkodst

Since 6467 Days

Family sharing will make a come back down the line.

In reply to

Prepare To Drop!!

Phaethon360

Since 7426 Days

Posted by GrimThorne

Hey, enjoy your physical media as long as you can.

You just seem like you've packed your bags for Mars when we just landed a probe there.

I have no doubt that eventually physical media will be done away with, but not before we have a working model and it's been implemented successfully. This generation is going to be about laying the groundwork, not launching the ships.

You have full faith in this despite the current generation's digital downloads being completely abandoned. You could download many popular games Day One, but then you're stuck with them on a console without a future, and servers that will be shut down. I have more than a few XBLA games on my 360 that if I lost I'd never get back today if I tried. Speaking of which, the whole limitations on XBLA games the first year was so they'd be future proof.

With executives making remarks like "Backwards compatibility is backwards thinking" it doesn't give me any faith in the fact that my Digital purchases are worth anything. At least with physical you can generally fill up your gas tank by selling a library of purchases.

Not to mention the whole idea that something akin to 40% of new games purchases are made from trade-ins. These are important numbers. And without a new model to accommodate them everyone loses.

In reply to

[quote=GrimThorne]Hey, enjoy your physical media as long as you can.[/quote]

You just seem like you've packed your bags for Mars when we just landed a probe there.

I have no doubt that eventually physical media will be done away with, but not before we have a working model and it's been implemented successfully. This generation is going to be about laying the groundwork, not launching the ships.

You have full faith in this despite the current generation's digital downloads being completely abandoned. You could download many popular games Day One, but then you're stuck with them on a console without a future, and servers that will be shut down. I have more than a few XBLA games on my 360 that if I lost I'd never get back today if I tried. Speaking of which, the whole limitations on XBLA games the first year was so they'd be future proof.

With executives making remarks like "Backwards compatibility is backwards thinking" it doesn't give me any faith in the fact that my Digital purchases are worth anything. At least with physical you can generally fill up your gas tank by selling a library of purchases.

Not to mention the whole idea that something akin to 40% of new games purchases are made from trade-ins. These are important numbers. And without a new model to accommodate them everyone loses.

GrimThorne

Since 7453 Days

Posted by BLackHawkodst

Family sharing will make a come back down the line.

I really have no doubts about that, but it will probably take the considerable diminishment of discs for MS to go full throttle. What I'm really encouraged about is that Microsoft isn't just paying attention to the complainers, but to the people who actually intend to purchase an Xbox One. What good does it do them to reverse policies for people who were never going to buy one in the first place?

It's a fuckin trap. MS needs to ignore these distractions and get back to business.

In reply to

Tinks

Since 7510 Days

Posted by GrimThorne

Hey, enjoy your physical media as long as you can.

When consoles go digital that'll be tragic. You won't be able to revisit anything when a generation follows it.
Instead of losing all your small indie games you'll lose 60 dollar purchases instead. NO THANKS

In reply to

GrimThorne

Since 7453 Days

Posted by Tinks

When consoles go digital that'll be tragic.

So Microsoft is going to build the infrastructure for 300,000 dedicated servers (a near $600 million dollar effort), only to shut it off and let it collect dust? That stuff is money in the bank. Look how much Microsoft continues to cash in on with late late late adopters of the 360. Spencer says they'll continue to support the 360 FOR YEARS. THIS is the reason why everyone is so frightened of digital games for consoles? Because you assume Microsoft is going to throw the off switch rather than continue to use it as a cash maker?

In reply to

gym4life

Since 6105 Days

Some cool stuff their, that gold share will come in very handy for me :)

In reply to

Phaethon360

Since 7426 Days

Posted by GrimThorne

So Microsoft is going to build the infrastructure for 300,000 dedicated servers (a near $600 million dollar effort), only to shut it off and let it collect dust? That stuff is money in the bank. Look how much Microsoft continues to cash in on with late late late adopters of the 360. Spencer says they'll continue to support the 360 FOR YEARS. THIS is the reason why everyone is so frightened of digital games for consoles? Because you assume Microsoft is going to throw the off switch rather than continue to use it as a cash maker?

The reason games like Robotron 2084, Marble Blast Ultra, Wik and Outpost Kaloki X aren't available for download isn't because Microsoft doesn't have the server space or bandwidth to accommodate XBLA games. When games stop selling they just don't feel the need to make them available.

Tell me that fact alone is an advantage over physical games. If Valve ever released a Steam 2 that couldn't use Steam games I'd abandon them too. When digital is done right (Amazon, iTunes, Steam, etc) you don't need to worry about the hardware. And until console manufacturers prove they understand this they do not have my support.

In reply to

[quote=GrimThorne]

So Microsoft is going to build the infrastructure for 300,000 dedicated servers (a near $600 million dollar effort), only to shut it off and let it collect dust?  That stuff is money in the bank.  Look how much Microsoft continues to cash in on with late late late adopters of the 360.   Spencer says they'll continue to support the 360 FOR YEARS.  THIS is the reason why everyone is so frightened of digital games for consoles?  Because you assume Microsoft is going to throw the off switch rather than continue to use it as a cash maker?[/quote]

The reason games like Robotron 2084, Marble Blast Ultra, Wik and Outpost Kaloki X aren't available for download isn't because Microsoft doesn't have the server space or bandwidth to accommodate XBLA games. When games stop selling they just don't feel the need to make them available.

Tell me that fact alone is an advantage over physical games. If Valve ever released a Steam 2 that couldn't use Steam games I'd abandon them too. When digital is done right (Amazon, iTunes, Steam, etc) you don't need to worry about the hardware. And until console manufacturers prove they understand this they do not have my support.

GrimThorne

Since 7453 Days

Posted by Phaethon360

When digital is done right (Amazon, iTunes, Steam, etc) you don't need to worry about the hardware. And until console manufacturers prove they understand this they do not have my support.

In many ways you've made my argument for me. It really doesn't matter what Microsoft does at this point. This is why they HAVE TO get back to their original plan, all the people who are complaining the loudest were never going to purchase anyway. You do know that ALL of those services you mentioned had TONS of issues when they first launched don't you? And I shouldn't have to mention just how much people hated Steam when it first launched, but just in case you've forgotten it was hated with an absolute passion. It took years for Valve to get it's act together.

But people actually gave Steam, iTunes and Amazon a chance to improve their services. Actually both products and services if you're talking about Amazon and Apple. None of them were perfect out the gate, and their eventual improvements were built around the community that actually supported them, not the non-customers who shouted and complained from the sidelines. And as bad as you may think Microsoft is, the original digital policies for the X1 were no where near as draconian as Valve. Was Valve going to let you sell your game licenses? Gift or lend your discs to family/friends for immediate play-rights on Steam? But I'm not going through that whole laundry list, Microsoft is now making a true effort to bring back the original policy.

In other words they're listening to the gamers that will actually matter to them on launch day. Not the people who obviously just came to throw rocks and eggs. lol!

In reply to

[quote=Phaethon360]

When digital is done right (Amazon, iTunes, Steam, etc) you don't need to worry about the hardware. And until console manufacturers prove they understand this they do not have my support.[/quote]

In many ways you've made my argument for me.  It really doesn't matter what Microsoft does at this point.   This is why they HAVE TO get back to their original plan, all the people who are complaining the loudest were never going to purchase anyway.   You do know that ALL of those services you mentioned had TONS of issues when they first launched don't you?  And I shouldn't have to mention just how much people hated Steam when it first launched, but just in case you've forgotten it was hated with an absolute passion.  It took years for Valve to get it's act together.

But people actually gave Steam, iTunes and Amazon a chance to improve their services.  Actually both products and services if you're talking about Amazon and Apple.   None of them were perfect out the gate, and their eventual improvements were built around the community that actually supported them, not the non-customers who shouted and complained from the sidelines.   And as bad as you may think Microsoft is, the original digital policies for the X1 were no where near as draconian as Valve.   Was Valve going to let you sell your game licenses?  Gift or lend your discs to family/friends for immediate play-rights on Steam?   But I'm not going through that whole laundry list, Microsoft is now making a true effort to bring back the original policy.

In other words they're listening to the gamers that will actually matter to them on launch day.   Not the people who obviously just came to throw rocks and eggs.  lol!

Phaethon360

Since 7426 Days

Yes. Because legitimate concerns are trolling. I don't understand your logic and I have no desire to try.

I've supported two Xboxes fully (the last through 7 or 8 malfunctions) and my concerns are a little more rational than your complacency.

So let's lol on it and part ways.

In reply to

GriftGFX

Since 7581 Days

^continues to ignore portability.. word.

In reply to

Tinks

Since 7510 Days

Posted by GrimThorne

So Microsoft is going to build the infrastructure for 300,000 dedicated servers (a near $600 million dollar effort), only to shut it off and let it collect dust? That stuff is money in the bank. Look how much Microsoft continues to cash in on with late late late adopters of the 360. Spencer says they'll continue to support the 360 FOR YEARS. THIS is the reason why everyone is so frightened of digital games for consoles? Because you assume Microsoft is going to throw the off switch rather than continue to use it as a cash maker?

Microsoft sees more profitability in eventually shutting down live on 360 when their next system has fully taken developer and consumer attention away. Just like the transition from Xbox to 360. To do anything else wouldn't make sense. All the digital downloads on 360 will be void within a year or two from now.
Otherwise they're just bleeding money keeping the service running for two consoles.
These PC services we're talking about aren't worth comparing to Xbox Live because they're very different. Yes they can offer digital downloads on both, but with a PC you're guaranteed infinite ownership. There have been too many lies concerning backwards compatibility each generation by all 3 console producers. Each time they flirt with it, and it just doesn't happen.
Digital downloads will make more sense for consoles when they're just being used as a bridge from your computer to the tv. Otherwise your purchases only exist with their monthly online service that'll extinguish when another system takes its place.
I can plug in a SNES, NES, Dreamcast, ETC, and play any game I want to. If a kid gets older and wants to play his downloaded Xbone/PS4 games from the digital download days they're screwed.

In reply to

[quote=GrimThorne]

So Microsoft is going to build the infrastructure for 300,000 dedicated servers (a near $600 million dollar effort), only to shut it off and let it collect dust?  That stuff is money in the bank.  Look how much Microsoft continues to cash in on with late late late adopters of the 360.   Spencer says they'll continue to support the 360 FOR YEARS.  THIS is the reason why everyone is so frightened of digital games for consoles?  Because you assume Microsoft is going to throw the off switch rather than continue to use it as a cash maker?[/quote]
Microsoft sees more profitability in eventually shutting down live on 360 when their next system has fully taken developer and consumer attention away. Just like the transition from Xbox to 360. To do anything else wouldn't make sense. All the digital downloads on 360 will be void within a year or two from now.
Otherwise they're just bleeding money keeping the service running for two consoles.
These PC services we're talking about aren't worth comparing to Xbox Live because they're very different. Yes they can offer digital downloads on both, but with a PC you're guaranteed infinite ownership. There have been too many lies concerning backwards compatibility each generation by all 3 console producers. Each time they flirt with it, and it just doesn't happen.
Digital downloads will make more sense for consoles when they're just being used as a bridge from your computer to the tv. Otherwise your purchases only exist with their monthly online service that'll extinguish when another system takes its place.
I can plug in a SNES, NES, Dreamcast, ETC, and play any game I want to. If a kid gets older and wants to play his downloaded Xbone/PS4 games from the digital download days they're screwed.

GrimThorne

Since 7453 Days

So I guess you guys aren't going to game on anything this generation?

What Tinks is posting sounds too much like he's forecasting the future of the END of the upcoming console generation. We haven't even gotten started and he's telling us how it's going to end.

Phaethon says he wants Microsoft to get it's services right like Steam even though Valve struggled terribly coming out the gate. I could ask if he's willing to give Microsoft a chance to do the same, but I think I already know what his answer is going to be.

So if the Kinect sensor goes away I'm willing to be that it still won't be enough will it?

In reply to

GriftGFX

Since 7581 Days

Posted by GrimThorne

So if the Kinect sensor goes away I'm willing to be that it still won't be enough will it?

Yes. It totally would be. But it won't so why are you asking?

And no. I'll continue to game on PC and maybe buy a PS4 and retail games. Because lol @ the thought that downloadable games on consoles is actually forward thinking.

In reply to

Tinks

Since 7510 Days

Posted by GrimThorne

This has nothing to do with all the recent bullshit MS went through and backtracked right back over. So please stop talking about it. I realize it's damaged you and you're holding onto it. That's fine.

This has to do with your proclamation of digital downloads being the future.
Digital downloads on 360 are dead in a year or two. The console's population will inevitably die just like every console before it. Thus bringing the Xbox Live service on 360 to be shut down because the population won't be worth it.
I'm forecasting an EASY to predict future here. It doesn't take a wizard.

In consideration to history, backwards compatibility is the least of MS, Sony, and Nintendo's concerns. To them that is an investment they don't need to make as we've seen through each generation.
IF they start doing total digital downloads for games with the currently Xbox Live model, your $60 games are fucked unless they're creating an online system that can be carried over to what comes after Xbox One. Which they likely aren't.

In reply to

[quote=GrimThorne][/quote]
This has nothing to do with all the recent bullshit MS went through and backtracked right back over. So please stop talking about it. I realize it's damaged you and you're holding onto it. That's fine.

[b]This has to do with your proclamation of digital downloads being the future.[/b]
Digital downloads on 360 are dead in a year or two. The console's population will inevitably die just like every console before it. Thus bringing the Xbox Live service on 360 to be shut down because the population won't be worth it.
I'm forecasting an EASY to predict future here. It doesn't take a wizard.

In consideration to history, backwards compatibility is the least of MS, Sony, and Nintendo's concerns. To them that is an investment they don't need to make as we've seen through each generation.
IF they start doing total digital downloads for games with the currently Xbox Live model, your $60 games are fucked unless they're creating an online system that can be carried over to what comes after Xbox One. Which they likely aren't.

GrimThorne

Since 7453 Days

In reply to

Ronsauce

Since 7566 Days

Posted by Tinks

your $60 games are fucked unless they're creating an online system that can be carried over to what comes after Xbox One. Which they likely aren't.

I haven't really followed this convo, but my feelings regarding this quote are as follows: fine by me.

My original Xbox didn't get one second of use the moment I got my 360, nor did any of my original Xbox games. I imagine the same will hold true for me for the Xbox One and its games when the Xbox One 2(?) is released.

In reply to

Zapp Brannigan: If we can hit that bull's eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards...Checkmate.

Phaethon360

Since 7426 Days

I played quite a bit of Halo 2 before Halo 3 came out. But that's neither here nor there. We're talking about breaking something that works (being able to play a physical game without worrying about accessing it from a server) for the convenience of being able to play it instantly (but for an indefinite amount of time *rental).

Technology is supposed to make things better not worse. And some people have it in their mind that this is an Xbox problem. It's not, so put down your flame shields. It's an industry issue.

In reply to

Phaethon360

Since 7426 Days

In other news:

So basically with the new Xbox One Gold rollover it killed the Family Pack Gold plan. It used to be that if you had multiple accounts on one Xbox 360 you just paid $99 a year. Now it's going to be $60/yr per account. So if you have 3 players on one 360 it's $180/yr if you all want to game. They're effectively trying to force you to upgrade to an Xbox One I guess...

Need clarification but this don't look good. Hopefully they make it and the Xbox One system identical.

In reply to

GrimThorne

Since 7453 Days

*sigh*

Phaethon, the Home Gold Sharing plan was created so you don't have to pay $180 a year. The only thing that's happening is that the family plan is being dropped. Only one Gold membership is required as long as they are in your household. Those could even be three separate Xbox Ones and they STILL could share the benefits of the one gold membership plan. This will include multiplayer, entertainment apps etc.

Only the "master" Gamertag will be allowed to take their X1's membership "on the go" Everyone else's account will be anchored at home. Nelson confirmed this yesterday by the way.

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