I've not played them extensively I'm afraid. I'm loathe to comment on a build I know isn't very polished but it seemed caught between two stools, i.e. there were elements of the new PoP but none of the character yet it isn't a full re-embrace of the aesthetic of the Sands trilogy. It seemed very by-the-numbers to me.

But I stress, don't read a lot in to that. I had the same impression when I saw the initial trailers and really I've not got much more to go on than those

No, only the Wii version which might even be a different game spun out to a different Ubi studio, as is often the case. There's no doubt plenty of polish will be applied to it before release. I just don't know what they are trying to achieve with this game beyond just trying to get a game out at the same time as the movie.

Guillemot was previously adamant this was a movie tie in. I know Avatar didn't work out so well for them but if they are going to make a movie tie in, they should make one. If they are going for fan appeasement (i.e. abandon PoP 08 and go back to SoT), they should do so but do either whole-heartedly.

I guess we'll see how they come out but there has been very little media for either up until now.

Edit: Wii version is definitely independent from 360/PS3 versions according to Ubisoft press release

I just think that unfamiliarity with the past Sands games might land you in a strange position Deft. Not doubting that you can make qualitative statements regardless, but fans of the Sands games will possibly be more open to this game from the outset.

You seem to, on some level, pair your disappointment over what could be a discontinuing of PoP08 with the notion that this is strictly a cash-in, and without the affinity for the past Sands games I think your view may be a bit harsh.

The Giant Bomb guys were recently at a preview event for this and they seemed to get the vibe from the presentation that Ubi may still pick up the PoP08 thread. I think as I commented earlier in this thread, Ubi's increased franchise strategy may well mean an alternation between the Sands series and 08, not unlike the way Acti handles CoD.

I do think that inherently, Sands of Time was a better, more intricate game than 08, but I also enjoyed the freedom and surrealism of 08. Those don't mix, they're like oil and water, so I appreciate that the Sands setup is brought back independently of 08, and hopefully they can co-exist.

Well I keep looking to Splinter Cell for reassurance there. I know some people didn't like Pandora Tomorrow, but I think everyone can agree it was a quality product.

I mean Warrior Within wasn't a bad game by any measure either. It had some graphics glitches and oddities, but mainly the problem with that game was the tone which was directly a result of a deliberate shift in marketing. I think if the tone is established, and I think between the movie and the popular opinion on the Sands trilogy, it IS at this point, I can see different teams putting a good enough product together.

I think not expecting any wild strides in gameplay could benefit them iterating on puzzles and platforming layout and things like that.

We'll see I guess. Not too far off now. I'm hoping the movie is fun too.

I thought each entry of SC got better, personally. 360 Double Agent is the worst by far, because they got too caught up in getting scenarios in there that were graphically snazzy, and that had a pretty adverse effect on a game built for shadow lurking.

On normal Xbox though, I think it goes Double Agent > Chaos Theory > Pandora Tomorrow > Splinter Cell.

Tonally they pretty much take turns too, with SC and CT being very industrial and the others being more guerrilla like. I really like them in contrast to one another, but CT prolly has the coolest and most consistent tone overall.

But man, vivid memories of crawling under the train in PT, wow. :D

The anger in WW was because Dahka.. Dhaakkkhhaaa... DAKKA.. Dae KIYEAAH! I dunno how they spelled it. Let's go with Dahka.

Yes, right, Dahka. The Dahka - some sort of time cop - had been hunting the prince for years in WW because what he did in Sands of Time upset the balance of time. Hunted for years with nowhere to hide for more than a day or so at a time puts bags under your eyes, american accent in your mouth and turns you generally pissy and homocidal. Evidently.

I doubt we'll see anything in this that informs the WW prince much, I think this is gonna be set pretty much in isolation so that they can build on this thread of games too. It would be nice to get some premonitions of the Dahka though. The DAYY CAAAAAA.


Ducka!

No it's not that. I appreciate they are excellent and much loved games. I said I haven't played them extensively, not that I hadn't played them at all. I enjoyed PoP 08 immensely yes but I'm certainly open minded to another thread. Your idea about iterating them bi-annually is a good one. It would be better than attempting to combine the two no?

All I'm saying, from what I've seen is that this game seems to be confused rather than self assured as to what direction it wants to go in.

Playing devils advocate for a moment, if this turns out to be a return to the SoT universe made "more accessible" by the introduction/reworking of mechanics from PoP08, who will that appeal to exactly? You yourself said Sands of Time was a better more intricate game. If this game is "less intricate" would you view it as a good thing?

And I'm not saying that is necessarily the case. It would be completely wrong to infer such a thing from the Wii version which publishers still presume they have to design for a "casual" audience. I'm just a little concerned that the story has changed from "it's a movie tie in" (when speaking to investors) to "it's not a movie tie in but it's the same universe" yet seemingly it still has to come out with the movie as far as Ubi are concerned (i.e. in May) and we've seen more or less nothing of it so far.

The intricacy I refer to is really more to do with the methodical way you play SoT, both in regards to its puzzles being ones you have to figure out, and its traversal platforming being something you have to plot out. Stopping and thinking, if I sum it up.

PoP08 is all about just hauling yourself forward, wind in hair, leaping effortlessly through these dreamy, surreal environments. Sure there's an element of consideration to your actions, especially when the Corruption spreads later in the game, but it's a game about momentum and freedom. Of vastness, landscapes and beauty.

I think as basic ideas, Sands of Time and PoP08 are so incredibly different that merging them would compromise both visions. I think it's lamentable that so few appreciated what PoP08 was doing, but I would hate for a sequel to that game to shoehorn in things that fundamentally mess with its core vision.

With Forgotten Sands, just from reading previews, listening to the Bombcast, looking at screenshots, I can't say I think it displays any of PoP08's direction. It looks to me like it's pretty faithfully going by the room/scenario jump/mechanical puzzle formula, only perhaps using the added tech oomph to casually shift the camera towards more majestic peripheral sights. That is just a vibe though obviously, and you're in a better position than I am to make that sort of judgement.

But yeah I certainly concede that the lack of coverage is worrysome. It is definitely reminicent of a movie tie in PR cycle in that regard.

As long as it isn't rushed and a technical mess, though, as I stated in the chatbox at some point I think Ubi can make a competent PoP in their sleep. Like the Lumines sequels - albeit never reaching the dizzying heights of the original Lumines - they are consistently a little bit Lumines and that's always a great thing.

Joystiq impressions of Wii version.

I would concur

http://www.joystiq.com/2010/02/25/impressions-prin...