ManThatYouFear
ManThatYouFear
Inscrit depuis 7525 Jours
Posté par GriftGFX
What the fuck are you on about? What research? You best believe Microsoft saw some hard fucking data before they made this decision. People had "defected."

I think you're being a paranoid twit, or just looking for reasons to bash Microsoft. It's one or the other :D
sorry i was taking the piss out there research on drm in that original interview. yeah made no sense lol
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PSN:ManThatYouFear
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Phaethon360 - Mr Pant<s>s</s>ies
Phaethon360
Inscrit depuis 7427 Jours
http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/2013/videogam...

Xbox One is #6 on the best selling video game products for 2013. That's cumulative of the entire year. Previously Amazon said the pre-order rate for both consoles was over 2,500 per minute and that they've eclipsed total Black Friday sales for 2012.

PS4 is only #2 btw
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Tinks
Tinks
Inscrit depuis 7511 Jours
THE DAMAGE HAS BEEN DONE

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docLEXfisti
docLEXfisti
Inscrit depuis 7700 Jours
Xbox Release date seems to be Nov. 27th
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the only tyrant I accept is my inner voice [and my two kids ;)]

ultimate gamers threat: "Watch it, or I'll spoil you all!"

docLEXfisti
docLEXfisti
Inscrit depuis 7700 Jours
Just read a few pages of discussions on VG24/7 and GAF and I am really beginning to dislike people who only rent their games and don't buy any - they are sucking out the energy of the industry and just don't seem to get it.

Microsoft's approach was good for developers and in the end, it would have been good for the customers as well. Some fail to see the really bigger picture here.
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the only tyrant I accept is my inner voice [and my two kids ;)]

ultimate gamers threat: "Watch it, or I'll spoil you all!"

alimokrane
alimokrane
Inscrit depuis 7511 Jours
Amazon UK best sellers for 2013 so far (PS4 at 4, Xbox One at 69!!!!). Well done MS, well deserved I must say.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/bestsellers/2013/videog...

Can I just say I am so glad to see Tomb Raider at number 3!!!
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docLEXfisti
docLEXfisti
Inscrit depuis 7700 Jours
Posté par alimokrane
Can I just say I am so glad to see Tomb Raider at number 3!!!
Yeah, but it's a failure! Millions is not enough! ;D
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the only tyrant I accept is my inner voice [and my two kids ;)]

ultimate gamers threat: "Watch it, or I'll spoil you all!"

alimokrane
alimokrane
Inscrit depuis 7511 Jours
Posté par docLEXfisti
Yeah, but it's a failure! Millions is not enough! ;D
Tell me about it...Something must be fundamentally wrong with the way AAA games are being developed when millions of sales dont actually translate to success - They simply can not blame this on 2nd hand games and rentals. Those who buy second hand and rent would never buy at launch anyway even if they were not able to buy second hand copies and rent. It's as simple as that, they will wait for the price to drop....
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GriftGFX - He can also<br>ban your ass!
GriftGFX
Inscrit depuis 7581 Jours
Posté par alimokrane
Tell me about it...Something must be fundamentally wrong with the way AAA games are being developed when millions of sales dont actually translate to success - They simply can not blame this on 2nd hand games and rentals. Those who buy second hand and rent would never buy at launch anyway even if they were not able to buy second hand copies and rent. It's as simple as that, they will wait for the price to drop....
He just got done using this as argument to strangle the rental market out of existence. And to diminish consumer/property rights. As Jim Sterling put it, an industry that needs Xbox One DRM to survive is a failed industry.

Watch TitanFall, with its 60-man team and "cheap" middleware make another billion dollars.
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Phaethon360 - Mr Pant<s>s</s>ies
Phaethon360
Inscrit depuis 7427 Jours
Pretty much this. Any other business that can't manage its finances doesn't stay in business. I could definitely go with more independent studios like Metro 2033 and The Witcher developers.

It didn't seem like the industry had trouble until the publishers started buying up the successful developers. Maybe they should just leave them alone.
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docLEXfisti
docLEXfisti
Inscrit depuis 7700 Jours
Really like that Kinect Sports Rivals trailer ... looks intriguing, let's see how that recognition turns out in the final game :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQJAYg8nWDc
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the only tyrant I accept is my inner voice [and my two kids ;)]

ultimate gamers threat: "Watch it, or I'll spoil you all!"

scoobs0688
scoobs0688
Inscrit depuis 6216 Jours
Posté par docLEXfisti
Really like that Kinext Sports Rivals trailer ... looks intriguing, let's see how that recognition turns out in the final game :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQJAYg8nWDc
You go ahead and check on that for us, we'll be playing titanfall
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add me on steam: scoobs18@gmail.com
add me on PSN: scoobs0688

Currently playing: Counterstrike:GO, Skyrim, WoW:MoP, SC2

sanex
Inscrit depuis 5769 Jours
Posté par docLEXfisti
Really like that Kinect Sports Rivals trailer ... looks intriguing, let's see how that recognition turns out in the final game :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQJAYg8nWDc
Sweet, that's my family Xmas party games sorted :)
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Frozpot
Frozpot
Inscrit depuis 7340 Jours
Posté par scoobs0688
You go ahead and check on that for us, we'll be playing titanfall
Because he can't have that and Titanfall? I forgot it's one or the other :P
Posté par Phaethon360
Pretty much this. Any other business that can't manage its finances doesn't stay in business. I could definitely go with more independent studios like Metro 2033 and The Witcher developers.

It didn't seem like the industry had trouble until the publishers started buying up the successful developers. Maybe they should just leave them alone.
Absolutely agree, but that doesn't mean that the Used and Rental markets( to a lesser degree) aren't an issue. Just because it's not the ONLY issue doesn't mean it isn't one.

That said, those two avenues ARE legal as well as a reality that devs need to build their business models/ development policies around.

I just worry that the industry is bleeding from cuts that aren't being bandaged, regardless of how unpopular it seems.
En réponse à

Oooh, Profound, isn't it?

Phaethon360 - Mr Pant<s>s</s>ies
Phaethon360
Inscrit depuis 7427 Jours
Used and rental markets aren't an issue. They are a part of life. I like Shigeru Miyamoto's stance on it: make games worth buying.

If this industry keeps trying to find ways to keep itself bloated and stagnant then eventually gamers won't have a reason to buy anything.
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Phaethon360 - Mr Pant<s>s</s>ies
Phaethon360
Inscrit depuis 7427 Jours
A very positive Ryse preview http://thekoalition.com/2013/06/ryse-son-of-rome-p...

Would have liked to see some real gameplay released afterwards over their E3 build. This game was my hope for 1:1 swordplay. The limited Kinect features are a mixed blessing.

Interested in seeing the multiplayer mode in action.

Also Project Spark has a beta sign-up page https://joinprojectspark.com/process
En réponse à
ManThatYouFear
ManThatYouFear
Inscrit depuis 7525 Jours
hey doc do you know howmuch lovefilm and co pay for each individual rental disk? it is not normal retail prices you know.
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PSN:ManThatYouFear
GT: ManThatYouFear
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Real Life: ThatTwat

BLackHawkodst
BLackHawkodst
Inscrit depuis 6468 Jours
Posté par Phaethon360
A very positive Ryse preview http://thekoalition.com/2013/06/ryse-son-of-rome-p...

Would have liked to see some real gameplay released afterwards over their E3 build. This game was my hope for 1:1 swordplay. The limited Kinect features are a mixed blessing.

Interested in seeing the multiplayer mode in action.

Also Project Spark has a beta sign-up page https://joinprojectspark.com/process
I'm signed up for the beta :)
En réponse à

Prepare To Drop!!

gym4life
Inscrit depuis 6106 Jours
Excellent read from the dev guys at Titainfall on the Cloud usage broken down.

Much more at the link - http://www.respawn.com/news/lets-talk-about-the-xb...
Hi everyone! I’m Jon Shiring, and I’m an engineer working with the Cloud technology that you’ve heard about for Respawn’s game Titanfall. I have seen a lot of confusion online and I think it’s worth explaining more about what we’re doing on Titanfall and also more generally about Cloud computing and dedicated servers.

First, let’s take a step back and dive into the common multiplayer design and talk about why Dedicated Servers are better.

Player-Hosted Servers

The vast majority of games will pick a player and have them act as the server for the match. This means that all of the other players talk to them to decide what happens in a game. When you shoot your gun, the server decides if that is allowed and then tells everyone what you hit. Let’s agree to call this system “player-hosted” for simplicity.

What kinds of problems do you get with player-hosted servers?



What if one player has great bandwidth, but it’s laggy? Games are having to choose between different player hosts, and have to make hard decisions about which one should be the host, with two different measurements – bandwidth and latency. Sometimes it will pick a host who has good bandwidth, but whose latency isn’t ideal. But we don’t want the game to make compromises on lag and we really want the game to feel the same every time we play. We really don’t want to worry about this stuff – we just want to play and have the game feel good.

What about host advantage? The player-host has the game running locally on their machine, so they get super low latency access to the game world. You’ve probably seen this in action as some player seems to see you long before you get to see them or their bullets hit you before yours hit them. That sucks. Nobody should have an artificial advantage in a competitive multiplayer game.

What if the player-host is a cheater? Since the host gets to make decisions about kills, XP, and unlocks and such, it’s really bad if they abuse their power to wipe out your stats, or they cheat by flying around maps and insta-killing people. It’s infuriating, in fact.

What if the host disconnects? In the “best case” for this, you can do host migration if there’s another player who has enough bandwidth and everyone else can talk to them. If you hit that jackpot, you can migrate from the old host to the new one, which pauses the game and then unpauses when the new player-host is ready to start acting as the server. This isn’t a fun process, and it can fail.

What if the host’s bandwidth disappears? The game tested the host’s bandwidth at some point and decided that they had enough to host. But someone at their house is now torrenting files and their roommate is streaming Netflix. That “great” bandwidth the game detected earlier is now awful bandwidth, and the other players are lagging halfway through a match.

What if some players can’t talk to the host? You know all that “Open NAT” stuff? Your home internet router is generally trying really hard to keep bad people out, and games are sort of a weird case where the game is trying to get your router to cooperate and let other players create connections INTO your network. Games need to check if every player can talk to the host and if one can’t then that host won’t work. It makes matchmaking slower, and we hate that. Also, by telling you to open up your router, the game is asking you to reduce the security of your home network in order to make the game work. It would be great if you didn’t have to compromise your security in order to play games.

What if nobody has enough bandwidth? You got a great group of players together, but nobody has enough bandwidth to actually host a game. You can work around this by compromising your matchmaking a little to make sure that each lobby has a player in it that can be a host. But we don’t actually want compromised matchmaking, so this isn’t a good fix.

What about players who are paying for their bandwidth or have bandwidth caps? If you have a bandwidth cap on your home internet connection, or even worse, you’re paying for your bandwidth, what happens when you play a game and later find out that the game thought you were an awesome host? Your home internet connection is now slow or you have a huge bill waiting.

So if I’m hosting, my machine is doing all this extra work on behalf of everyone else? Yes! You are doing more work on your CPU than all of the other players are. This means the game isn’t as cool looking as it could be and everyone else has extra CPU just sitting there. Or worse, their game actually looks better than yours! We think the game should be consistent on every machine in a match. Don’t punish the host with a worse game or leave all of that extra CPU sitting empty on the other players machines.

Okay, so player-hosted servers have a lot of downsides. So why do so many games use them? They have one really big upside – it doesn’t cost money to run the servers! Running hundreds of thousands of servers can be extremely expensive. EXTREMELY expensive. Like “oh my god we can’t afford that” expensive. So your player experience gets compromised to save (large amounts of) money.


Dedicated Servers


Dedicated servers are when a computer sitting out on the internet handles all of the host duties, leaving every client free to just be a client.
•You can get even more CPU on your dedicated servers to do new things like dozens of AI and giant autopilot titans!
•Suddenly you have no more host advantage!
•Bandwidth for the servers is guaranteed from the hosting provider!
•You can use all of the available CPU and memory on the player machines for awesome visuals and audio!
•Hacked-host cheating isn’t an issue!
•Matchmaking can be lightning fast since it’s guaranteed that everyone can connect to your servers.
•And since the servers aren’t going to go disconnect to watch Netflix, you don’t need to migrate hosts anymore!

The player experience is so much better. This sounds awesome!


But it costs a LOT of money.


This is something I have worked on for years now, since coming to Respawn. A developer like Respawn doesn’t have the kind of weight to get a huge price cut from places like Amazon or Rackspace. And we don’t have the manpower to manage literally hundreds-of-thousands of servers ourselves. We want to focus on making awesome games, not on becoming giant worldwide server hosting providers. The more time I can spend on making our actual game better, the more our players benefit.


I personally talked to both Microsoft and Sony and explained that we need to find a way to have potentially hundreds-of-thousands of dedicated servers at a price point that you can’t get right now. Microsoft realized that player-hosted servers are actually holding back online gaming and that this is something that they could help solve, and ran full-speed with this idea.


The Xbox group came back to us with a way for us to run all of these Titanfall dedicated servers and that lets us push games with more server CPU and higher bandwidth, which lets us have a bigger world, more physics, lots of AI, and potentially a lot more than that!
En réponse à
GriftGFX - He can also<br>ban your ass!
GriftGFX
Inscrit depuis 7581 Jours
That's really long for something that says almost nothing new. Are we sure Optimus didn't write it?
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gym4life
Inscrit depuis 6106 Jours
A lot of that stuff i'm not to familiar with, so it explained it nicely for me.
But it’s not just for dedicated servers – Microsoft thought about our problem in a bigger way. Developers aren’t going to just want dedicated servers – they’ll have all kinds of features that need a server to do some kind of work to make games better. Look at Forza 5, which studies your driving style in order to create custom AI that behaves like you do. That’s totally different from what Titanfall uses it for, and it’s really cool! So it’s not accurate to say that the Xbox Live Cloud is simply a system for running dedicated servers – it can do a lot more than that.
I hope I get to see some examples of this soon.
En réponse à
KORNdog
KORNdog
Inscrit depuis 6985 Jours
All that "cloud computing" info sounds an awful lot like standard dedicated servers to me. Are they really going to continue trying to convince people "the infinite power of the cloud" is more then that?
En réponse à
deftangel - Hot stuff!
deftangel
Inscrit depuis 7449 Jours
Posté par Phaethon360
Used and rental markets aren't an issue. They are a part of life. I like Shigeru Miyamoto's stance on it: make games worth buying.

If this industry keeps trying to find ways to keep itself bloated and stagnant then eventually gamers won't have a reason to buy anything.
Used/rental existing aren't an issue. The extent of which retailers take the piss with it is. Gamers and developers alike lose out with the current set up and it's a shame the publishers and platform holders haven't been able to put aside their self interest and come up with a workable solution to address it.

Why the publishers don't handle the trade-ins themselves and give (better) credit back on their own games is beyond me.

In theory, a centrally managed licence transfer system that ensured the retailer was adequately compensated for the risk and the publisher got a cut could have meant fairer trade-in prices. It's a shame it was so poorly thought-through.
Posté par gym4life
Excellent read from the dev guys at Titainfall on the Cloud usage broken down.

Much more at the link - http://www.respawn.com/news/lets-talk-about-the-xb...
It's cool that Xbox Live subs are subsidising Azure access for Xbox One developers to use for this stuff. I just wish they would call it what it is. Some developers were doing this already on Amazon etc.
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http://twitter.com/deftangel

BLackHawkodst
BLackHawkodst
Inscrit depuis 6468 Jours
Cool read, nice to know they are using it for more than just dedicated servers, but that's sweet enough anyway.

Found this interesting.
I personally talked to both Microsoft and Sony and explained that we need to find a way to have potentially hundreds-of-thousands of dedicated servers at a price point that you can’t get right now. Microsoft realized that player-hosted servers are actually holding back online gaming and that this is something that they could help solve, and ran full-speed with this idea.

With the Xbox Live Cloud, we don’t have to worry about estimating how many servers we’ll need on launch day. We don’t have to find ISPs all over the globe and rent servers from each one. We don’t have to maintain the servers or copy new builds to every server. That lets us focus on things that make our game more fun. And best yet, Microsoft has datacenters all over the world, so everyone playing our game should have a consistent, low latency connection to their local datacenter.

Most importantly to us, Microsoft priced it so that it’s far more affordable than other hosting options – their goal here is to get more awesome games, not to nickel-and-dime developers. So because of this, dedicated servers are much more of a realistic option for developers who don’t want to make compromises on their player experience, and it opens up a lot more things that we can do in an online game.
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Prepare To Drop!!

alimokrane
alimokrane
Inscrit depuis 7511 Jours
hmmm...I am inclined to think this is a good idea but MS was just shit at selling it really.
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